Twinreaper

No problem. If you ever need to know anything about specific assett or engine mechanics, don't hesitate to ask. Hope to see you online soon man! And if your still over in Afghan, stay safe and thanks for doing what you do everyday in the name of the United States.

Yeah, the rate of fire is going to be a main sticking point. But from what I have uncovered about the tweaks...it is already written in stone, on how the scripts are handling the changes. The question remains...how much of it can they tweak without drastic adverse effects on the other data fields? I'm with you in hoping that they can and will reduce the rate of fire on the DMR. The pistol however, I dont mind. but they should have left that alone and just tweaked the damage levels of it. When comparing the way it fires to the H1 pistol, they are more similar at default.

First off bro, these guys don't get bloom. They actually still think that the blooming reticule on the screen is why the weapons fire the way they do. Dead wrong. You can find info on bloom directly from frankie over at Bungie.org. They did an interview with him on the Title Update and he tells you just what bloom is more or less. But anyway, I'll explain it all out for you. And yes, this information is rock solid and pulled directly out of Reach's tags and data fields.... Bloom: Bloom is a function of the HUD (heads up display). This feature is responsable for the conrracting and expanding of the aiming reticule. Bloom has been a feature of the HUD since Halo 3. The purpose of bloom, is to give players a real time indication of what area they can expect their shots to land. Bloom does not nor did it ever control where the wepaon fires. Bloom gets it's vector, or "blooming" from data in the [weap] tag. [Weap]: This is how "weapon" looks when browsing a tag layout in halo title. The weapon tag is where all wepaon functionality is stored. In the weapon tag, you can find data on what we call "attachments", "Firing effects", "projectile" used, "models, "fp_animations" and a lot more stuff. The particular fields in which bloom gets it's movment data from are the following fields in the weapon tag are..... (some are named differently actually) "fire recovery time"- the amount of time before a next shot can be fired "distribution angle" - the total amount of spread available for projectiles "error angle" - the amount of increased spread. usually a small number for "minimum", then usually the total angle for the "maximum" "distribution function" - controls if the projectile is normal, or fires in other patterns like "fan" The remaining factors that are given to the blooming reticule from the [proj] tag, or "projectile". Hopefully this isn't too technical and gives you a better understanding of what bloom is. Now in terms of new maps, yes Reach is getting new maps. CEA will not have any type of stand alone multiplayer experience outside of co-op campaign. This was done so that 343 did not end up dividing the player base up. The TU does make the DMR fire like the Battle Rifle, but the amount of power it has depends on if they tweaked the default damage responses. If you are talking about just basic removal of blooming reticule, then no. it still has the same amount of power behind every shot as it always did. The pistol yes, has been tweaked to deliver more damage per shot that it had before the TU.

Ugh, you guys still dont get the bloom thing do you? Take a look at an official interview with frankie. he addresses the bloom and what it is. He goes on to explain it the same way I have always explained it to you guys. The bloom is a reticule only visual and in no way is responsable for how the weapon fires. The TU that everyone is so fond of, is not only stopping the reticule from blooming, but it is also adjusting the "error cone" or firing radius of the weapon. It's been discovered, that the new script function they have released with the TU uses about 7 new scripted floats that override the original wepaon tag values. These 7 floats are what are making the wepaons act the way they are, not bloom. And since when does bloom have anything to do with recoil? Since when was recoil ever an issue in any Halo game ever?!? Reach is the first time ever, people even thought to bring this up. I still don't get what the major issue is though. I see a lot of people always quick to compare H2/H3 gameplay to Reachs', but you simply can't do that. No Halo title plays like the one before it. Everything about the gameplay mechanics, physics and handling is different. I get it, that a lot of people don't like the direction reach took, but it is no different than the way Halo 3 took a different path than H2, or the way halo 2 is completely worlds apart from H1. Everyone will always have a varying opinion when it comes to these types of things. And because opinions differ so much, that is why it is important from a developers aspect to not let peoples opinions dictate core functions of a game engine. Doing so would cause more outrage and varying opinions. In the end it would end up being an endless battle of back and forth and that battle would take massive amounts of time and money to fund. We got exacrtly the game we paid for with reach. Again, you say the beta, you played the beta, and you read about everything they were putting into the game before it came out. if just now, a year later you realize you made a bad purchase, that is on you, not the developer. And personally I dont like your default / purist addition in that post. you the hell are you to decide what is right and wrong? Little arogant there don't you think? Gamews mean different things to everyone, and yes those opinions should all be respected. But don't say things like "respect", then blatently catogorize people like "default" or "purist". It makes one group out to be superior to the other.

No, you are taking this the wrong way completely. What I was trying to say is, that you had a choice before you decided to play the game. You were well aware of what to expect in terms of game play and physics. Coming in here almost a year, or now a year later and complaining about things you don't like is a bit childish. If you really had a problem with these things before, why did everyone wait till now to speak up about in the masses like they are doing now? I am in no way calling Reach perfect. Every game has it's flaws and I can personally point out tons of flaws in the code and game assets. All I am trying to do is state a fact, the game was created to encapsulate everything Bungie ever wanted to throw into a Halo game. They didn't make it for us, it was more for them. Is that a bit selfish...yes. But I hardly expect someone else to come in a clean up a mess that someone else made. On a side note, everyone wants to keep barking at 343 to fix Reach. Do you realize what happens when 343 gets enough of these hate and fix it mails from the community? Eventually MS comes down and tells 343 to fix what is requested due to popular demand to keep the bucks flowing in. At that point, this takes away development resources from future titles. And on another side note, Reach or the game in general is not just another piece of software that can be fixed. You should research the particular version of the engine used in Reach as well as the MegaloScript handling before you label it as simple software that can be fixed. The reticule bloom fix alone requires an additional script of commands to change 7 float point values of a weapon just to achieve it. Allowing people to adjust it manually in-game for customs is out of the scope of MegaloScript. Most of the fixes this community has demanded would require core engine fixes. Do you really want to go and buy a new 1.5 game disc for another $59.99?

Unfortunatly it is a vast majority of the community experiencing these problems, and 343 themselves can do little about it. Much of the problem is derived from the vast amount of data that the 360 unit has to collect and forward on udp ports to the Live Reach servers for stats and what not. Since the beginning, there was lag in all matches, but not as noticeable. From what I have been able to review and look at, most of the problem is coming from the TU that has been released to the wild. First thing you have to understand is how the TU works. The TU is basically a set of commands being issued in the form a script from the MegaloScript portion of the Blam! engine. This additional set of scripts overrides cor tag values on weapons, attributes and many other things. This not only causes an abnormal spike in processing, but also an additional drain on bandwidth, since now there is additional items that need to be synced to all players. The only way to overcome any of these issues, would be for 343 to cut down the amount of insignificant data collected and displayed on ones service record, and or better write the code used to initialize the TU changes.

That is quite a good guess, but I am still not sure about it all. Once we actually get it next month, I plan on writing a map handler so I can start uncovering more in depth, tag and string ID value tables. Hopefully, I will be able to uncover enough about the tag encryption to do this. If they are using the same tag name encryption scheme they did with Reach.....then it will be a while before I can post any usefull data in terms of how different each mode is and why.

They do sound fantastic. It's hard to believe the drastic improvement. I am curious though if they just ran the original sounds from Halo CE and Reach thru a post processor, and tweaked some of the sound tag reverb settings. Or did they completely go back and create brand neew sounds for it. Still, very amazing stuff. If this is what they churned out for a simple re-make... imagine what Halo 4 is gonna sound like!!!

Hey Anteraan, if you knew anything about the tag structure of Reach, MegaloScript, or any other Halo title, you would know that that the game engine doesn't use a random generator, nor does random numbers have anything to do with bloom. Do you know what exactly bloom is? Or are you just spamming around trying to get your post count up? I know the mechanics of the game systems incorporated into Halo and the Blam! engines. As for your little poke at luck... Here are a few actual dictionary definitions of luck.... explain how they apply to to Halo after reading my explanation as to how they don't.... 1. events that are beyond control and seem subject to chance; fortune 2. an unknown and unpredictable phenomenon that causes an event to result one way rather than another; "bad luck caused his downfall"; "we ran into each other by pure chance" 3. the state of happening by chance And chance.... 1. The unknown and unpredictable element in happenings that seems to have no assignable cause 2. A force assumed to cause events that cannot be foreseen or controlled; luck 3. An accidental or unpredictable event Chance nor Luck apply to Halo. Luck as stated and widely accepted, would suggest that during gameplay, noone has control of set variables or reactions to eachothers actions, but rather an outside unseen variable. This of coarse is not true, since I can show you many lines of extracted netcode data and show you all operations and variables. There are no magical generated ones. Chance also like luck, has no hand in any video game. There are no unpredictable events or elements. All of those things are hard coded into the game and or engine. Even a random number generator is not luck or chance. If you know the syntaxes being used, you can equate the same generation of numbers as the computer, AI etc... Just because most of the time, you fail to notice the miniscule amount of vector your shot is actually aimed at and lost the battle, does not constitute it being luck or chance in the opponents favor. You just simply didn't have the shot lined up as accuratly as the guy who gave you a new breathing hole. People just need to accept the fact that they are not perfect. Man is flawed and makes mistakes, it takes a true man to admit he made a mistake. Boys just cry about how it's unfair and how things should change to be in their favor. Thanks for reading folks. Enjoy the rest of your day! Reaper out!

I can give one good solid reason why all of the things in reach are good ideas....because Bungie said so. From the very start they made it very clear to everyone, that Reach was going to be a game THEY WANTED TO DO ALL THE THINGS THEY EVER WANTED TO ADD IN A HALO GAME! I'm sorry, but everyone had plenty of time to read up and learn the game. It's been over a year now, and still you expect someone else to fix up some things you knew from the start you didn't like or thought were bad? Do you same people go back to a car dealer a year later and demand they update your ride because you don't like certain things about the manufactured vehicle, like how long the gas peddle is? Or how hard the seats are? Simple answer to that is no. You deal with it. You do your research about it before you get to the lot and purchase it. Same principles apply to Reach. Do you ever really go to a game store and just pick a game up based on the cover art, then cry about how poor the game is after you play it? That's just crazy. You all read things, you all played the beta. Get over it and sit down.

Syndicate, bloom is not the real issue here. the issue is how they tied the blooming reticule adjustment into adjusting the firing spread of the dmr and other weapons. Bloom itself just shows you how much of a cool down period there is between shots before the system increases the radius of the weapons spread. All they did was make the firing radius and timing adjustable in an easy way that even the community could understand. It takes too much time to efficiently describe and corollate all the tag specific data and mechanics to properly explain the system ina way that a majority of players would accept. Just for ease of understanding, zero bloom just gives the DMR, Pistol etc, a more battle rifle firing effect. it adds nothing to skill, just allows you to pound the trigger without any negative side effects. Aiming is little issue, as the "hitboxes" for the heads is slightly greater than that of the previous titles. Having a firing radius that expands and contracts based on how you fire the weapon, makes it require more skill. There is no such thing as luck in a video game or life. Luck is term used to explain the end product of a certain chain of events that have played out without 100% knowledge of the observer or participant. True luck would imply that life or a game has no set variables or rules ruling actions and effects.

Seeing this post really made me miss the one thing that used to keep these awesome players around..... CLANS! It is the single most useful function that was ever added to a Halo game. It really helped make Halo 2 that much better. Let's face it, it's hard to keep your friends list from reaching it's max. Adding the clan feature back would help combat this and also keep like minded players like snipers, more organized and together. I completely agree. Hey 343, show some love for Snipers and Clans again!!!!

halo Ball is my absolute fav! I am starting up an official Hub for this gametype. hokey is the best especially when you get paired with a bunch of guys who share the same passion. I mean killing once in a while is ok, but spamming the crap out of everyone just for the sake of killing is boring and mindless. I love to play with my son. he get's the true play and feel of the experience and has a great time coming up with attack plans. Sadly he always sticks me in goal cause I rock at goaltending.

conscider it squashed Capwn3d. It would help, and I am unsure why they decided after Halo 2, to rely on player hosting for multiplayer matches. My guess is that becuase most of the time when you play, you are more likely to be paired with people who reside in the same country or even timezone. using a player host based system for those particular types of matches are ideal, but only if the host has a great upstreem bandwidth as you said. My best guess would be because of all of the innovations within the multiplayer game they made, required more resources to be freed on the server end. It does take quite a bit of time for their servers to collect the data, shift it to the right sql style data table, reparse it, then transmit it thru the API's in real time. But then again, they got tons of dough to invest in equipment. Then again, using a dedicated game setup would benefit only people with low ping, or those close to where the servers are based. But it is rather annoying to have the game crap out on the score screen and hold there for what seems to be an infinity while host negotiations with the server go on. I'd trade lag and leading shots for getting rid of that crap for sure. Could you have imagined the chaos if halo 1 and 2 had that host shiz? This and the annoying issues plaguing the game are prolly a good reason why 75% of the people on my friends list are always playing custom games. At least you know who you are playing with and what kind of connection to expect.

Actually both are correct but overlooked another issue that has been plaguing the Live system since Halo 2....... connection and host. The wat Live determines host is not a very well thought out component of the logistical Live operations. Live in matchmaking picks hosts based on their current at the moment connection speed and stability. Majority of the time,.someone with a half assed connection gets host. This leads to horrible lag or said host being kicked from the match. Same goes with other players. Quite a few times in the past month I was kicked from Live and trust me....my connection is as stable and fast as it gets. When I am not on Live my home server hosts 3 dedicated servers for Halo.1 pc, 1 Halo 2 PC server, a Crysis 2 server, MW 1 server and a teamspeak channel. None of my server regulars have ever reported an outage or lack of service. So if my simple home server can do all that at once on a phenom x3 platform, why is the Live service struggling to keep up? They put tons of money and hardware behind the service and matchmaking. Really makes you wonder....

And I am the one sounding like an ass? Just because you do not understand how to load a Halo title map, display string ID tables and display meta data in a "meta editor" style container.... do not talk down to me, or insult my work and progress that I do in terms of modifications to a great game. I really don't understand what you are trying to accomplish. All I do is provide proof for those who have questions or comments about game engine related items. I am sorry that you are too short sighted to see that and have dedicated all 8 of your posts this far, to nothing more than flaming a respected member of this community. You sir will not make many friends here acting in this way. I'm done. Please lock this thread Twam or Spectral.

I'm assuming that was meant as sarcasm.

I'm actually glad to hear that. I may have to come up with a cool MLG style icon for HaloBall and start posting up stuff like top ten "Best Scores" and stuff like that. I'll see what i can come up with in the next few weeks and post up some relevant info when I get the chance.

Wow really? What does my lacking of skill as I get older, have anything to do with the fact that I have superior proven knowlege base with all halo games and their respective Blam! engines? I have been modding and writing map applications since early 02, what have you done that can prove your worthiness with the halo community? Oh wait, these lame ass half baked accusations and flaming is about all you can muster. Everyone like you, has stated before their opinions...but where is your proof of certain things you claim to be true about what you are trying to pass off as fact about "bloom"? As usual, when you can't prove your right and someone has spanked the **** out you when it comes to game mechanics and simple tag operations....you resort to calling people out on their skill or lack of skill with gaming. It's ok, keep deflecting to another subject other than the one your losing at.....I won't think any less of you.

Just wanted to get some feedback regarding the greatest underated gametype ever! HaloBall!!!! I love haloball especially the hockey variant. IS there any official tourny or league for Haloball around anywhere? I really want to get some type of team for this going or possibly start up some sort of Haloball vid gallery. Kinda like what we have now for grifball. Anyone interested or have any information on all this?

I'm happy now cause I have fellow old farts to game with!! Win Win! And I am also happy becuase Twam actually made a rare appearance above there! Been some time Twam....all is well I hope?

I agree with the concept but pulling it off would be no fun in any way for the developer. While it may seem simple, there are many vertices, faces and edges that the engine would have to calculate to make fully scalable items without any type of aspect lock. It's one thing to just adjust the scale of an item, but it is a completely seperate beast to be able to adjust different isolated sections of geometry. Having something like this would resemble a 3d application blended with the Sapien object placing tool. Both would be way to memory consuming for a console to pull off viably. But then again with the advancement in the MegaloScript engine and or any other direction 343 decides to head in engine wise...it may be possible. Though i dont sensibly see it being available on the current hardware limitations of the 360. Overall very good concept. It would definatly add to the Forge experience and really give forgers a new dimension of playability. What are your thoughts on a Forge type variant involving certain aspects of the campaign?

yes you are correct. There is no "bloom" reticule on the BR. but the BR does have a firing spread. As I stated before bloom is just a widget function in the HUD tags. It has no relatrion to how or does it at all control the weapon or how it fires.

I'm happy because now I don't feel like I am all alone in my old age around here.....TY Spectral!!!!

Well more to the specific point, it's actually more about how the game engine was designed to handle the formats in terms of memory flow. Yes the 360 is quite capable of more. For example look at Crysis 2. The amount of poly's rendered on the screen at one time can well exceed 1,200,000. Yes that's one million two-hundred thousand polys. But that is also because the Crytek team designed the engine to handle this and be memory efficient enough to properly utilize the 360 hardware. Same goes for BF3 and MW3. In terms of rendering detail far and close, the other game engines have Blam! beat by a mile.