Ordinance Drop Flawed Idea

[Man of The People]

Ordinance Drop for Infinity Slayer is not a Great Idea. If Player One is doing better then player two and is rewarded for it with a power weapon or an ability to give them an advantage, how is Player two ever going to succeed.

[CandiBunni]

You're rewarded with an Ordinance Drop for getting five kills (That's at least what it looked like in the video. Points for other achievements during the game may also count.) You don't have to get them all in one life, so unless the other player is downright terrible they should be able to get at least one OD. Don't forget that if one player does get an OD and chooses a weapon, the other player can still kill them and get said weapon. They can steal it from the other player before they get the chance to pick it up or use it. So long as players of similar skill levels are matched up in matchmaking, this really shouldn't become an issue.

 

I will be sticking to regular Team Slayer (No ODs), but playing Infinity Slayer every now and then is something I could see myself doing.

[Man of The People]

You're rewarded with an Ordinance Drop for getting five kills (That's at least what it looked like in the video. Points for other achievements during the game may also count.) You don't have to get them all in one life, so unless the other player is downright terrible they should be able to get at least one OD. Don't forget that if one player does get an OD and chooses a weapon, the other player can still kill them and get said weapon. They can steal it from the other player before they get the chance to pick it up or use it. So long as players of similar skill levels are matched up in matchmaking, this really shouldn't become an issue.

 

I will be sticking to regular Team Slayer (No ODs), but playing Infinity Slayer every now and then is something I could see myself doing.

 

The Player that is more experienced will probably get the ordinance first, and once they get an ordinance drop they'll be sure to keep it, the less experienced player doesn't stand a chance of killing an experienced player who knows the map and is also awarded a rocket launcher for their kill streak. Even if the less experienced player eventually kills the more experienced player, if the more experienced player can save their ordinance drops even after they've been killed what's to stop the experienced player from spawning back calling an ordinance drop and getting another rocket launcher or other weapon/ability.

[CandiBunni]

The Player that is more experienced will probably get the ordinance first, and once they get an ordinance drop they'll be sure to keep it, the less experienced player doesn't stand a chance of killing an experienced player who knows the map and is also awarded a rocket launcher for their kill streak. Even if the less experienced player eventually kills the more experienced player, if the more experienced player can save their ordinance drops even after they've been killed what's to stop the experienced player from spawning back calling an ordinance drop and getting another rocket launcher or other weapon/ability.

 

Like I said above, if they are able to match players of similar skill levels in matchmaking then it shouldn't be an issue. Both players should be close enough in experience that it won't come to this. When you get your OD meter full you're given three options. 343 has already said that you're not going to, for example, get rockets three times in a row and such. Every OD will be tailored to the map being played. A smaller, more close quarters map won't feature things like Sniper Rifles and Rocket Launchers. Likewise a larger, more long range map might not feature shotguns, the scattershot, etc. in their ODs. Ordinance Drops don't stack, so you either use it or you won't receive any others.

 

If matchmaking pairs players against one another based on their statistics and skill level situations like this should not happen. For custom games this may happen depending on who is playing together, but there isn't really much you can do about that. For those that wish to player without Ordinance Drops you will be able to do so. Play regular Team Slayer if you don't want to worry about this sort of thing.

[Man of The People]

Like I said above, if they are able to match players of similar skill levels in matchmaking then it shouldn't be an issue. Both players should be close enough in experience that it won't come to this. When you get your OD meter full you're given three options. 343 has already said that you're not going to, for example, get rockets three times in a row and such. Every OD will be tailored to the map being played. A smaller, more close quarters map won't feature things like Sniper Rifles and Rocket Launchers. Likewise a larger, more long range map might not feature shotguns, the scattershot, etc. in their ODs. Ordinance Drops don't stack, so you either use it or you won't receive any others.

 

If matchmaking pairs players against one another based on their statistics and skill level situations like this should not happen. For custom games this may happen depending on who is playing together, but there isn't really much you can do about that. For those that wish to player without Ordinance Drops you will be able to do so. Play regular Team Slayer if you don't want to worry about this sort of thing.

 

The matchmaking system tends to try to pair players based on their skill levels, but there usually is that one player who is better then others. It's good to know that players won't be able to stack their ordinance drops. Hopefully matchmaking will be more improved in pairing up players based on their skill.

 

But Ordinance Drop is comparable to care packages in COD, and care packages were awarded to players that achieved kill streaks, these same players were often more skilled then the other players, the more skilled players tended to continuously pwn the less skilled players simply because they spawn with better guns giving them an advantage making the game no fun for the less skilled player. This is one of the reason players in COD tended to hack and cheat in order to beat the more skilled players ( not saying players in halo don't hack and cheat it's just much, much less often, (thank you Ban Ham)). Halo has been safe from this unfair type of gameplay because of the fact that everyone is given the same options to spawn with and nothing is awarded to a player for kill streaks making the game fair and based mostly on skill. Currently in Halo if someone is terrible it's not because they are at a disadvantage it's because they are just less skilled and still have more to learn about the game. In COD if someone is terrible it's often because the more skilled player has better weapons just because they've played the game longer giving the less skilled player no chance of winning because the more skilled played already spawns with better guns and those better guns help the player to achieve more kill streaks that add on to their advantage. Ordinance drops being the same as care packages will most likely have the same effect, keeping the strong strong and the weak weak.

[eliteultra]

Yea you guys have a point...but this is my idea... i think of it as an ok thing because 1. they are not as over powered as COD over powers the players with vehicles 2. Infinity slayer is a Team game so it is not possible for 1 person that has similar ranking to all the others to kill off the whole enemy team...so team work may help...

so you guys do have a point, but i feel like it is something ok in the game

[Des Feux]

In previous Halo games, players who played the game for longer, as you just said, still had an advantage over newcomers. More experienced players knew weapon spawns, player spawns, map control...etc. For Halo 3 at least this was not a problem thanks to the 1-50 rank system, as Ms. Mystic mentioned before. If Halo 4 has a similar system for pairing up players with the same skill level then this concern should be unexistent.

[SatanicBagels]

In previous Halo games, players who played the game for longer, as you just said, still had an advantage over newcomers. More experienced players knew weapon spawns, player spawns, map control...etc. For Halo 3 at least this was not a problem thanks to the 1-50 rank system, as Ms. Mystic mentioned before. If Halo 4 has a similar system for pairing up players with the same skill level then this concern should be unexistent.

 

Halo's ranking systems are one of our most trusted instruments. Long have they lead the competetive gaming world with honor and distinction. But the inability of Halo 3's ranking system to safeguard competetive gameplay... was a colossal failure.

[Des Feux]

Halo's ranking systems are one of our most trusted instruments. Long have they lead the competetive gaming world with honor and distinction. But the inability of Halo 3's ranking system to safeguard competetive gameplay... was a colossal failure.

Halo: Reach's ranking system*

[SatanicBagels]

Halo: Reach's ranking system*

 

This one's 1-50... and this one's time based ranks are the same. Your Bungie had promised you freedom from a doomed ranking structure. But you will find no salvation with either ranking systems. Those who built these ranking systems knew what they wrought. Do not mistake their intent or all will perish as they did before.

[Man of The People]

Yea you guys have a point...but this is my idea... i think of it as an ok thing because 1. they are not as over powered as COD over powers the players with vehicles 2. Infinity slayer is a Team game so it is not possible for 1 person that has similar ranking to all the others to kill off the whole enemy team...so team work may help...

so you guys do have a point, but i feel like it is something ok in the game

 

Your Welcome to your opinion, but things like ordinance drops shouldn't even be in competitive gameplay like infinity slayer because players will no longer win because of their skill, their going to win because they managed to get their ordinance drop first. They are as over powered as COD care packages, but in Halo Standards. In Halo The Rocket Launcher, Sniper Rifle, and Shotgun are all considered power weapons, and now with ordinance drops you can spawn yourself one after obtaining a 5 kill streak, people no longer have to wait for these power weapons to spawn, they'll probably be at least three or more of these weapons on the map at a time from people using ordinance drops. Even though infinity slayer is a team game, someone could just pick a sniper rifle on the map, gain 5 kills then ordinance drop them self another. Currently in Halo if someone uses the rocket launcher or the sniper rifle they have to wait for another one to spawn in the same location it always spawns giving everyone a fair chance to pick up that weapon, with ordinance drop rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns (and any other power weapon) are going to become as common on the map as DMRs and Assault Riffles. Team work will be either to protect your teammate using the sniper rifle until he gets his ordinance drop and spawns himself another, and it's not that hard to take out a team of 4 when your team has rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns. The Power Weapons are going to become the most used weapons in Infinity Slayer, and what skill does it take to use a power weapon. As I said before infinity slayer won't be about skill it'll be about who gets the power weapons first ( a.k.a who gets the ordinance drop first).

 

Ordinance Drop isn't Just A problem for players with little experience, it's also a problem for talented players who like to win their games based on their skill and not a power weapon. Even experienced players will have a problem when their opponent can just ordinance drop a rocket launcher instead of having to fight with with an Assault Riffle or DMR. It's not competitive play worthy.

[SatanicBagels]

Your Welcome to your opinion, but things like ordinance drops shouldn't even be in competitive gameplay like infinity slayer because players will no longer win because of their skill, their going to win because they managed to get their ordinance drop first. They are as over powered as COD care packages, but in Halo Standards. In Halo The Rocket Launcher, Sniper Rifle, and Shotgun are all considered power weapons, and now with ordinance drops you can spawn yourself one after obtaining a 5 kill streak, people no longer have to wait for these power weapons to spawn, they'll probably be at least three or more of these weapons on the map at a time from people using ordinance drops. Even though infinity slayer is a team game, someone could just pick a sniper rifle on the map, gain 5 kills then ordinance drop them self another. Currently in Halo if someone uses the rocket launcher or the sniper rifle they have to wait for another one to spawn in the same location it always spawns giving everyone a fair chance to pick up that weapon, with ordinance drop rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns (and any other power weapon) are going to become as common on the map as DMRs and Assault Riffles. Team work will be either to protect your teammate using the sniper rifle until he gets his ordinance drop and spawns himself another, and it's not that hard to take out a team of 4 when your team has rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns. The Power Weapons are going to become the most used weapons in Infinity Slayer, and what skill does it take to use a power weapon. As I said before infinity slayer won't be about skill it'll be about who gets the power weapons first ( a.k.a who gets the ordinance drop first).

 

Ordinance Drop isn't Just A problem for players with little experience, it's also a problem for talented players who like to win their games based on their skill and not a power weapon. Even experienced players will have a problem when their opponent can just ordinance drop a rocket launcher instead of having to fight with with an Assault Riffle or DMR. It's not competitive play worthy.

 

you could always choose not to play infinity slayer you know. and play other gametypes. Since I share almost all of your concerns here this is what I will be doing.

[Des Feux]

1. ordinance drops shouldn't even be in competitive gameplay like infinity slayer because players will no longer win because of their skill, their going to win because they managed to get their ordinance drop first.

 

2. people no longer have to wait for these power weapons to spawn, they'll probably be at least three or more of these weapons on the map at a time from people using ordinance drops. Even though infinity slayer is a team game, someone could just pick a sniper rifle on the map, gain 5 kills then ordinance drop them self another.

 

3. Currently in Halo if someone uses the rocket launcher or the sniper rifle they have to wait for another one to spawn in the same location it always spawns giving everyone a fair chance to pick up that weapon.

 

4. Team work will be either to protect your teammate using the sniper rifle until he gets his ordinance drop and spawns himself another, and it's not that hard to take out a team of 4 when your team has rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns.

 

5. The Power Weapons are going to become the most used weapons in Infinity Slayer, and what skill does it take to use a power weapon. As I said before infinity slayer won't be about skill it'll be about who gets the power weapons first ( a.k.a who gets the ordinance drop first).

1. And being able to get your Ordinance Drop first isn't skill?

 

2. Ordinance Drops will not drop the same weapon twice, so you can't have a sniper rifle, fill up the OD meter and get another one.

 

3. Players didn't have a ''fair chance'' of picking up the weapon since maybe other players with a better weapon or more skill are nearby and prevent them from getting the weapon that just spawned. Now everyone has the same amount of chance of getting a PW rather than having to fight with someone camping near the weapon spawn.

 

4. ''it's not that hard to take out a team of 4 when your team has rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns.'' Well, how about the other team has PWs to counter the ones your team has since they can also call OD?

 

5. The same concept is applied for previous Halo games, where players with more skill or better spawns got the power weapons before and totally dominated less skillful players. OD also deal with the issue of people camping near PW.

 

I understand your concerns. Ordinance Drops are a new concept that if done wrong can ruin MP, but 343i are taking the right approach, at first it is difficult to understand how OD make the game more balanced, but trust me they do. Besides, you can always chose not to play Infinity Slayer, eh?

[Man of The People]

you could always choose not to play infinity slayer you know. and play other gametypes. Since I share almost all of your concerns here this is what I will be doing.

 

Thanks for the advice, but if infinity slayer is the new team slayer and/or competitive playlist then something has to be said.

 

1. And being able to get your Ordinance Drop first isn't skill?

 

2. Ordinance Drops will not drop the same weapon twice, so you can't have a sniper rifle, fill up the OD meter and get another one.

 

3. Players didn't have a ''fair chance'' of picking up the weapon since maybe other players with a better weapon or more skill are nearby and prevent them from getting the weapon that just spawned. Now everyone has the same amount of chance of getting a PW rather than having to fight with someone camping near the weapon spawn.

 

4. ''it's not that hard to take out a team of 4 when your team has rocket launchers, sniper rifles, and shotguns.'' Well, how about the other team has PWs to counter the ones your team has since they can also call OD?

 

5. The same concept is applied for previous Halo games, where players with more skill or better spawns got the power weapons before and totally dominated less skillful players. OD also deal with the issue of people camping near PW.

 

I understand your concerns. Ordinance Drops are a new concept that if done wrong can ruin MP, but 343i are taking the right approach, at first it is difficult to understand how OD make the game more balanced, but trust me they do. Besides, you can always chose not to play Infinity Slayer, eh?

 

1) Power Weapons don't require skill

 

2) I said if you pick a sniper rifle already on the map, then after getting 5 kills get yourself another one with the ordinance drop

 

3) No one will camp the weapon spawns besides people that already got a rocket launcher or shotgun through ordinance drop, and they'll only camp those areas to prevent players who haven't obtained a power weapon from getting one.

 

4) The other team won't be able to call an ordinance drop because they'll be getting killed constantly by the team that got their ordinance drop first.

 

5) Ordinance Drop only deals with the issue of people camping near power weapons by already giving people power weapons, once a player has a power weapon through the ordinance drop they'll only go to the actual power weapons spawn to camp and prevent the other team from acquiring that weapon or to refill ( still preventing them from picking up that weapon).

 

Ordinance Drop unbalances the game, previous Halo games are good because they make it so that there are only a few power weapons on the map at a time. If you want an example of something in Halo like ordinance Drops that made the game unbalanced, play invasion slayer as the elites on Hemmorage, the Spartans start off with a range advantage, and once they get the sniper rifle from the weapons drop the elites get pwned and can't even get the next capture point because their getting killed by the sniper rifle. Ordinance Drop does not balance the game.

 

People that get the ordinance drop are going to camp the other power weapons spawns and keep the other team from ever making a comeback. There really isn't much someone can do with an assault rifle, DMR, or battle Rifle against a guy holding a rocket launcher or sniper rifle. And don't say "not everyone's going to use the sniper rifle, rocket launcher, or other power weapons" because we all know everyone will.

[CandiBunni]

Thanks for the advice, but if infinity slayer is the new team slayer and/or competitive playlist then something has to be said.

 

 

 

1) Power Weapons don't require skill

 

2) I said if you pick a sniper rifle already on the map, then after getting 5 kills get yourself another one with the ordinance drop

 

3) No one will camp the weapon spawns besides people that already got a rocket launcher or shotgun through ordinance drop, and they'll only camp those areas to prevent players who haven't obtained a power weapon from getting one.

 

4) The other team won't be able to call an ordinance drop because they'll be getting killed constantly by the team that got their ordinance drop first.

 

5) Ordinance Drop only deals with the issue of people camping near power weapons by already giving people power weapons, once a player has a power weapon through the ordinance drop they'll only go to the actual power weapons spawn to camp and prevent the other team from acquiring that weapon or to refill ( still preventing them from picking up that weapon).

 

Ordinance Drop unbalances the game, previous Halo games are good because they make it so that there are only a few power weapons on the map at a time. If you want an example of something in Halo like ordinance Drops that made the game unbalanced, play invasion slayer as the elites on Hemmorage, the Spartans start off with a range advantage, and once they get the sniper rifle from the weapons drop the elites get pwned and can't even get the next capture point because their getting killed by the sniper rifle. Ordinance Drop does not balance the game.

 

People that get the ordinance drop are going to camp the other power weapons spawns and keep the other team from ever making a comeback. There really isn't much someone can do with an assault rifle, DMR, or battle Rifle against a guy holding a rocket launcher or sniper rifle. And don't say "not everyone's going to use the sniper rifle, rocket launcher, or other power weapons" because we all know everyone will.

 

 

1. Every weapon requires some type and amount of skill to use. The Sniper Rifle takes quick reflexes and very precise aiming to score a headshot. The rocket Launcher requires you to know where your opponent is going to be when you fire it and judge how far you need to be before letting go a rocket. The shotgun and energy sword require you to get in close enough to use them effectively. All of these require you to have good aim in general and the knowledge of how to use them against different types of weapons. So yes, power weapons do require skill to use (effectively).

 

2. If you haven't heard, the ODs won't give you the same options twice in a row. The ODs, depending on the map, will have certain weapons that are available. All of these are on a random rotation, so the chances of getting a sniper rifle twice in a row is smaller. Weapons in ODs are also tailored to each map. This means that only larger maps will feature things like Rocket Launchers and Sniper Rifles, with closer range maps featuring shotguns and the like.

 

3. Players have always camped power weapon spawns. With the OD system that tactic becomes far less effective because now everyone has a chance to get a weapon. What is to stop one team from killing the other and receiving ODs to counter the opposing team's campfest?

 

4. You don't seem to get what I and others have said. If Halo 4's matchmaking is able to pair up players with very similar skill levels and experience then this will not be an issue. If Halo 4 is able to do what I just said, you will have games where everyone on both sides is getting ODs throughout the match.

 

5. See 3.

 

The gameplay we saw at E3 is still being tweaked. We're still not completely sure just how the OD system is going to work out, so I would suggest holding off on forming any final thoughts. If the game is released and things aren't as balanced as they could be then 343 Industries is sure to listen and patch things.

[The Director]

Ordinance drops take into account kill assists, close calls, and a variety of other things as well. Once you get to a certain amount of points, you get an ordinance drop. The current things included in ordinance drops are overshields, damage boosts, speed boosts, the scattergun, and the Sticky Grenade (the grenade launcher that looks like a pistol). While these will give you a decent advantage, when you use an ordinance drop, it doesn't always land right at your feet. All ordinance drops also have a waypoint above them for every player on the map. So, if you are trying to hide, or are in a lower level, calling in ordo is a bad idea because it will either give away your position, or land above you.

 

Now, let's get onto the OP. In this theoretical situation you've crafted to point out that this is a bad idea, it seems as if you are talking about a 1v1 while playing Infinity Slayer. An experience player vs. an inexperienced player. Now, in this situation the inexperienced player is ALWAYS at a disadvantage, unless you are playing a game where skill doesn't matter at all. However, if the inexperienced player can manage to get five kills (mind you, not five kills in a row without dying, but five kills AT ALL) then they will get an ordinance drop for their troubles. And they can use it whenever they want to, it doesn't go away unless they use it.

 

Historically speaking, Halo has always had a pretty steep learning curve when compared to other leading FPS games. However, in every FPS game, an inexperienced player will not commonly beat an experienced one. That being said, you point is not valid because you used something that is applicable to every feature of every FPS game invented so far. If we took your theory of it giving a bonus to the experienced player meaning it's a bad idea and applied it to other features, then customizable controls are a bad idea, maps are a bad idea, power weapons and vehicles are a bad idea, and precision weapons are also a bad idea. Basically, entire games become a bad idea. This renders your argument about inexperienced players vs. experienced players invalid.

 

So, let's talk about what would happen if we were to pit two experienced players of similar skill level together. What would the ordo drops be then? They wouldn't give either player an advantage, because both can use them to their own benefit. They add in a bit of fun and thrill instead. It adds in a little bit of strategy, rather than just running and gunning.

 

A for instance of the strategy that ordinance drops will bring to the table:

You get an ordinance drop because you've killed five enemies, however three of the five enemies have respawned near you. Calling in the ordinance drop will alert them to your location and give them a chance to kill you for it. What you decide to do instead is run back to where your team is, and allow the guy who is obviously having an off game pick it up instead to help your teams chances of victory.

 

As you can obviously tell, I do not consider Ordinance Drops to be a bad idea, and I fail to see how you could think that they would be.

[Man of The People]

1. Every weapon requires some type and amount of skill to use. The Sniper Rifle takes quick reflexes and very precise aiming to score a headshot. The rocket Launcher requires you to know where your opponent is going to be when you fire it and judge how far you need to be before letting go a rocket. The shotgun and energy sword require you to get in close enough to use them effectively. All of these require you to have good aim in general and the knowledge of how to use them against different types of weapons. So yes, power weapons do require skill to use (effectively).

 

2. If you haven't heard, the ODs won't give you the same options twice in a row. The ODs, depending on the map, will have certain weapons that are available. All of these are on a random rotation, so the chances of getting a sniper rifle twice in a row is smaller. Weapons in ODs are also tailored to each map. This means that only larger maps will feature things like Rocket Launchers and Sniper Rifles, with closer range maps featuring shotguns and the like.

 

3. Players have always camped power weapon spawns. With the OD system that tactic becomes far less effective because now everyone has a chance to get a weapon. What is to stop one team from killing the other and receiving ODs to counter the opposing team's campfest?

 

4. You don't seem to get what I and others have said. If Halo 4's matchmaking is able to pair up players with very similar skill levels and experience then this will not be an issue. If Halo 4 is able to do what I just said, you will have games where everyone on both sides is getting ODs throughout the match.

 

5. See 3.

 

The gameplay we saw at E3 is still being tweaked. We're still not completely sure just how the OD system is going to work out, so I would suggest holding off on forming any final thoughts. If the game is released and things aren't as balanced as they could be then 343 Industries is sure to listen and patch things.

 

1) So your saying each time before you use the: sniper rifle ( which uses auto-aim), sword (which uses lunge), shotgun ( which uses a wide aim range), and rocket launcher ( precision are you serious?),you take all these measurements into account. How long do your games take?

 

2) ( Can't Stress this enough), I'm not saying you use the ordinance drop for sniper rifle twice, I'm saying you find a sniper rifle thats already on the map, use the sniper rifle that was already on the map to get kills, once you get 5 kills with the sniper rifle that you had already found on the map ( and did not use ordinance drop to get), you use ordinance drop to get another.

 

3) The players that get the ordinance drop first are going to be the ones that camp the other power weapons spawns first to prevent other players from reaching them. And players that camp the power weapon spawns ( before they get their ordinance drop) and manage to get their power weapons will get their kills with the power weapons, but instead of them now having to use a basic weapon once they've run out (of the power weapon) they probably earned enough kills with their old power weapon to ordinance drop another. Ordinance drop isn't ending camping it's rewarding it.

 

4) 1) No halo game has ever really been able to match up players according to their skill ( Halo 3did the best job with ranked matches, and yes I know about Reachs hidden true skill system, it isn't good). 2) It is difficult for a team to fight against another team that managed to get their rockets, shotguns, or sniper rifle's first. If two people are evenly matched in true skill the game soon becomes whoever gets the best weapon first wins ( a.k.a power weapon first, a.k.a ordinance drop first).

 

5) There is no 5, so I'll just say Ordinance Drop shouldn't even be in competitive gameplay. Things like ordinance drop belong in campaign, custom games or a playlist that isn't ranked.

 

The Title Post is Ordinance Drop Flawed Idea ( not final thought), and I know 343 listens to the forums ( which are good........ some of the time).

[CandiBunni]

1) So your saying each time before you use the: sniper rifle ( which uses auto-aim), sword (which uses lunge), shotgun ( which uses a wide aim range), and rocket launcher ( precision are you serious?),you take all these measurements into account. How long do your games take?

 

2) ( Can't Stress this enough), I'm not saying you use the ordinance drop for sniper rifle twice, I'm saying you find a sniper rifle thats already on the map, use the sniper rifle that was already on the map to get kills, once you get 5 kills with the sniper rifle that you had already found on the map ( and did not use ordinance drop to get), you use ordinance drop to get another.

 

3) The players that get the ordinance drop first are going to be the ones that camp the other power weapons spawns first to prevent other players from reaching them. And players that camp the power weapon spawns ( before they get their ordinance drop) and manage to get their power weapons will get their kills with the power weapons, but instead of them now having to use a basic weapon once they've run out (of the power weapon) they probably earned enough kills with their old power weapon to ordinance drop another. Ordinance drop isn't ending camping it's rewarding it.

 

4) 1) No halo game has ever really been able to match up players according to their skill ( Halo 3did the best job with ranked matches, and yes I know about Reachs hidden true skill system, it isn't good). 2) It is difficult for a team to fight against another team that managed to get their rockets, shotguns, or sniper rifle's first. If two people are evenly matched in true skill the game soon becomes whoever gets the best weapon first wins ( a.k.a power weapon first, a.k.a ordinance drop first).

 

5) There is no 5, so I'll just say Ordinance Drop shouldn't even be in competitive gameplay. Things like ordinance drop belong in campaign, custom games or a playlist that isn't ranked.

 

The Title Post is Ordinance Drop Flawed Idea ( not final thought), and I know 343 listens to the forums ( which are good........ some of the time).

 

 

1. The sniper rifle does not use auto-aim. I don't know what gave you this idea, but that is completely wrong. You have to aim at their head to score a headshot, it isn't just given to you for simply firing in their direction. Don't confuse aim assistance with auto aiming. They are two completely different things. That being said, aim assist is on every weapon, so trying to use it as a complaint for the Sniper Rifle and why it takes no skill (or very little) is silly.

 

You have to get in close enough range to use the energy sword. If you aren't within the swords range then the weapon is useless.

 

The shotgun has a large spread at far distances. Again you have to be in close range to use it effectively. The further away your target is, the less likely your shots are going to hit them at all.

 

I never said precision with the Rocket Launcher. If you go back and read more carefully you will see that I said the Rocket Launcher requires you to judge where your opponent is going to be once your rocket actually reaches them. You also need to take into account the distance from your target; is the splash damage also going to hurt you or will you need to aim even further ahead so that the rocket hits just as they reach that area?

 

2. Read what I said again. Ordanance drops are randomised to a degree. You are not guaranteed a Sniper Rifle simply for using one that was already on the map. You could take the map Sniper and use its ammo, then when you receive an OD you might be given the option for Rockets, Overshield, or the Sticky Pistol. See what I'm saying?

 

3. How do you know this? How are you certain that those who call in an OD are going to be the first to try camping weapon spawns? Don't forget that power weapon spawns are viewable to all players at all times, so camping doesn't really become that much of an issue. Everyone will know where the power weapons spawn and when they do spawn everyone will be able to head for them. Staying in one area waiting for a power weapon to spawn when other players are out getting kills and calling in Ordanance Drops is a bad idea.

 

4. Actually I think that Halo 3 did a decent job at it, but that is besides the point. The point I'm making is that if Halo 4's matchmaking system is able to match players with similar skill levels up then ODs will not be an issue.

 

5. There will be a playlist for Team Slayer (No ODs) for those who do not like the idea of Ordinance Drops. If you're one of those who don't then just play the Team Slayer playlist(s), which feature no ODs, instead. Things are still being tweaked and balanced, for all we know they've already thought of these situations you're so worried about and done what they can to fix them.

[SatanicBagels]

1) So your saying each time before you use the: sniper rifle ( which uses auto-aim), sword (which uses lunge), shotgun ( which uses a wide aim range), and rocket launcher ( precision are you serious?),you take all these measurements into account. How long do your games take?

 

I do somewhat agree with your other points but feel the need to point out that except for the rocket launcher which is debatable, all of these weapons do require a certain degree of skill to use. Namely the sniper rifle.

[Des Feux]

1) So your saying each time before you use the: sniper rifle ( which uses auto-aim), sword (which uses lunge), shotgun ( which uses a wide aim range), and rocket launcher ( precision are you serious?),you take all these measurements into account. How long do your games take?

 

2) ( Can't Stress this enough), I'm not saying you use the ordinance drop for sniper rifle twice, I'm saying you find a sniper rifle thats already on the map, use the sniper rifle that was already on the map to get kills, once you get 5 kills with the sniper rifle that you had already found on the map ( and did not use ordinance drop to get), you use ordinance drop to get another.

 

3) The players that get the ordinance drop first are going to be the ones that camp the other power weapons spawns first to prevent other players from reaching them. And players that camp the power weapon spawns ( before they get their ordinance drop) and manage to get their power weapons will get their kills with the power weapons, but instead of them now having to use a basic weapon once they've run out (of the power weapon) they probably earned enough kills with their old power weapon to ordinance drop another. Ordinance drop isn't ending camping it's rewarding it.

 

4) 1) No halo game has ever really been able to match up players according to their skill ( Halo 3did the best job with ranked matches, and yes I know about Reachs hidden true skill system, it isn't good). 2) It is difficult for a team to fight against another team that managed to get their rockets, shotguns, or sniper rifle's first. If two people are evenly matched in true skill the game soon becomes whoever gets the best weapon first wins ( a.k.a power weapon first, a.k.a ordinance drop first).

 

5) There is no 5, so I'll just say Ordinance Drop shouldn't even be in competitive gameplay. Things like ordinance drop belong in campaign, custom games or a playlist that isn't ranked.

 

The Title Post is Ordinance Drop Flawed Idea ( not final thought), and I know 343 listens to the forums ( which are good........ some of the time).

 

1) Sniper doesn't use auto-aim.

2) Since there is already an Sniper rifle on the map the OD system WON'T SEND ANOTHER ONE.

3) Who said there where going to be power weapons already on the map? 343i has never said there are going to be power weapons already laying down on the map when you spawn, the whole OD system would be pointless then. That said, OD are not rewarding camping, they are encouraging you to outside and get some kills since power weapons will not spawn on the map, you have to earn them.

4) That was the whole point of the previous Halo games, ''whoever gets the best weapon first wins'', clearly the player with better map control got the best weapon therefore dominating other players, with OD everyone has the same chance of getting a PW(balance right there). Then this is where skill is going to be important.

5) You're repeating the same response all over again.

 

After what we all have said you still think OD are a bad idea I suggest you go outside and get some fresh air or read a book. IMO this is just complaining for the sake of complaining.

[Man of The People]

Ordinance drops take into account kill assists, close calls, and a variety of other things as well. Once you get to a certain amount of points, you get an ordinance drop. The current things included in ordinance drops are overshields, damage boosts, speed boosts, the scattergun, and the Sticky Grenade (the grenade launcher that looks like a pistol). While these will give you a decent advantage, when you use an ordinance drop, it doesn't always land right at your feet. All ordinance drops also have a waypoint above them for every player on the map. So, if you are trying to hide, or are in a lower level, calling in ordo is a bad idea because it will either give away your position, or land above you.

 

Now, let's get onto the OP. In this theoretical situation you've crafted to point out that this is a bad idea, it seems as if you are talking about a 1v1 while playing Infinity Slayer. An experience player vs. an inexperienced player. Now, in this situation the inexperienced player is ALWAYS at a disadvantage, unless you are playing a game where skill doesn't matter at all. However, if the inexperienced player can manage to get five kills (mind you, not five kills in a row without dying, but five kills AT ALL) then they will get an ordinance drop for their troubles. And they can use it whenever they want to, it doesn't go away unless they use it.

 

Historically speaking, Halo has always had a pretty steep learning curve when compared to other leading FPS games. However, in every FPS game, an inexperienced player will not commonly beat an experienced one. That being said, you point is not valid because you used something that is applicable to every feature of every FPS game invented so far. If we took your theory of it giving a bonus to the experienced player meaning it's a bad idea and applied it to other features, then customizable controls are a bad idea, maps are a bad idea, power weapons and vehicles are a bad idea, and precision weapons are also a bad idea. Basically, entire games become a bad idea. This renders your argument about inexperienced players vs. experienced players invalid.

 

So, let's talk about what would happen if we were to pit two experienced players of similar skill level together. What would the ordo drops be then? They wouldn't give either player an advantage, because both can use them to their own benefit. They add in a bit of fun and thrill instead. It adds in a little bit of strategy, rather than just running and gunning.

 

A for instance of the strategy that ordinance drops will bring to the table:

You get an ordinance drop because you've killed five enemies, however three of the five enemies have respawned near you. Calling in the ordinance drop will alert them to your location and give them a chance to kill you for it. What you decide to do instead is run back to where your team is, and allow the guy who is obviously having an off game pick it up instead to help your teams chances of victory.

 

As you can obviously tell, I do not consider Ordinance Drops to be a bad idea, and I fail to see how you could think that they would be.

 

"Sigh"

 

First if a player is trying to hide why would they use an ordinance drop in the first place if they now it will give their position away.

 

Dear Second Paragraph, of course the inexperienced player is at a disadvantage, inexperienced players are always at a disadvantage against experienced players, but at least the experienced player wasn't given an advantage like ordinance drops. The inexperienced player and the experienced one were fighting at the same level with the same spawn options, but now the experienced player gets rewarded for pwning the inexperienced player he is fighting. ( Did you read the previous posts??) And you need only get 5 kills not even in a row to get the ordinance drop, That Even Worse Then Having To Get A Kill Streak.

 

To answer you third paragraph, all the things such as: maps, customizable controls, power weapons and vehicles, every player has access these to and they aren't awarded to players for earning points, their given to you when you buy the game. Everyone can go to the start menu and customize their controls ( it's not reserved for experienced players), everyone has the same spawn loadouts and spawns with the same weapons ( at least in Halo, thank you Bungie), and everyone spawns with a map in their corner ( did you not spawn with a map in the corner of your screen???)

 

Calling out Paragraph Number Four! If you want Strategy go play Starcraft. The only strategy involved in Halo is deciding which weapon you are going to use to defeat your opponent and how your going to do it ( will you go left, right, down, up and when). And when I pick up a rocket launcher I'm pretty sure I have the advantage over someone using an assault rifle, even if he also has a power weapon then it's whoever gets the first kill with their power weapon and picks up the other persons takes the advantage, this wouldn't happen if power weapons only spawned on the map like they do in every current halo game. And now that I know that players can get an ordinance drop without a kill streak the map is probably going to be littered with power weapons.

 

And Last But Not Least this goes out to Paragraph Number Five.

That is a good strategy to use with the Ordinance Drop, and then after said player gives his failing teammate the ordinance drop they will continue to pwn the other team now that there failing teammate has been given a power weapon as an advantage. While that is strategy, it really isn't that hard to think to give your teammate who is having an off day the power weapon.

 

Obviously I can tell you like the Ordinance Drop ( doe), if you fail to see why I think ordinance drops is a bad idea then you haven't read any of my previous posts. P.S you can read this one too. I still feel Ordinance Drop is a flawed idea and I don't care if you do, I'm just stating my opinion.

 

(These comments I've made in my posts aren't just the ideas of one person their the ideas of many people that I've played through the Halo Series with, I'm a messenger and voice myself, and if I seem rude it's because I don't like saying the same thing twice and/or answering questions I find silly)

[Absolute Dog]

Keep it polite. You do not want a mod sending you a warning. This is how you post.

 

After what we all have said you still think OD are a bad idea I suggest you go outside and get some fresh air or read a book. IMO this is just complaining for the sake of complaining.

[Baby Boo]

Well, I see a good debate, finally.

 

First off, matchmaking will be selected by finding those in your skill level, like halo 3. So if you are level 1 recruit, you will have no problem, as you'll be paired in 1- maybe 10. Just like if you were say level 9 warrent officer grade 1, you wouldn't be paired with a level 48 Forerunner. So skill gaps are definitely not an issue.

[Man of The People]

1. The sniper rifle does not use auto-aim. I don't know what gave you this idea, but that is completely wrong. You have to aim at their head to score a headshot, it isn't just given to you for simply firing in their direction. Don't confuse aim assistance with auto aiming. They are two completely different things. That being said, aim assist is on every weapon, so trying to use it as a complaint for the Sniper Rifle and why it takes no skill (or very little) is silly.

 

You have to get in close enough range to use the energy sword. If you aren't within the swords range then the weapon is useless.

 

The shotgun has a large spread at far distances. Again you have to be in close range to use it effectively. The further away your target is, the less likely your shots are going to hit them at all.

 

I never said precision with the Rocket Launcher. If you go back and read more carefully you will see that I said the Rocket Launcher requires you to judge where your opponent is going to be once your rocket actually reaches them. You also need to take into account the distance from your target; is the splash damage also going to hurt you or will you need to aim even further ahead so that the rocket hits just as they reach that area?

 

2. Read what I said again. Ordanance drops are randomised to a degree. You are not guaranteed a Sniper Rifle simply for using one that was already on the map. You could take the map Sniper and use its ammo, then when you receive an OD you might be given the option for Rockets, Overshield, or the Sticky Pistol. See what I'm saying?

 

3. How do you know this? How are you certain that those who call in an OD are going to be the first to try camping weapon spawns? Don't forget that power weapon spawns are viewable to all players at all times, so camping doesn't really become that much of an issue. Everyone will know where the power weapons spawn and when they do spawn everyone will be able to head for them. Staying in one area waiting for a power weapon to spawn when other players are out getting kills and calling in Ordanance Drops is a bad idea.

 

4. Actually I think that Halo 3 did a decent job at it, but that is besides the point. The point I'm making is that if Halo 4's matchmaking system is able to match players with similar skill levels up then ODs will not be an issue.

 

5. There will be a playlist for Team Slayer (No ODs) for those who do not like the idea of Ordinance Drops. If you're one of those who don't then just play the Team Slayer playlist(s), which feature no ODs, instead. Things are still being tweaked and balanced, for all we know they've already thought of these situations you're so worried about and done what they can to fix them.

1) Sniper doesn't use auto-aim.

2) Since there is already an Sniper rifle on the map the OD system WON'T SEND ANOTHER ONE.

3) Who said there where going to be power weapons already on the map? 343i has never said there are going to be power weapons already laying down on the map when you spawn, the whole OD system would be pointless then. That said, OD are not rewarding camping, they are encouraging you to outside and get some kills since power weapons will not spawn on the map, you have to earn them.

4) That was the whole point of the previous Halo games, ''whoever gets the best weapon first wins'', clearly the player with better map control got the best weapon therefore dominating other players, with OD everyone has the same chance of getting a PW(balance right there). Then this is where skill is going to be important.

5) You're repeating the same response all over again.

 

After what we all have said you still think OD are a bad idea I suggest you go outside and get some fresh air or read a book. IMO this is just complaining for the sake of complaining.

 

Ms. Mystic You have some valid points, and thank you for keeping this on an informative level, and not persuasive like The Jackal Ultra ( I have no clue what his actual title says, smh, so I'll just call him by his forum rank)

But the Sniper Rifles do have a pretty hardcore aim assist, at least when I'm using in I notice it ( especially in Halo 3)

 

The other weapons still don't require skill I have around a 5.00 k/d with the shotgun and around a 3.00 with sword all because I know to pick them up and get close to the enemy, that doesn't require much skill. And you said the rocket launcher requires you to know where your opponent is going to be and fire ahead of them ( that's considered precision).

 

I didn't say just because you have a sniper rifle your going to get one ( I'm not going to force you to, read what I said again though)

 

Most players ( or to "quote" The Director, strategic players) know not allowing the other team to obtain power weapons is achievable by camping the power weapon spawns, camping the spawns is a good way to stop the other teams progress

 

To Number 4) I've already answered and The Jackal Ultra wants me to stop repeating myself ( I'm trying to stop, but people make the same arguments)

I will play which ever one is the new competitive playlist, and if it's infinity slayer ( which it probably will be) then I have to voice my concerns ( Please note people they are concerns, thank you for realizing that Ms.Mystic unlike a few others)

 

To The Jackal Ultra

1) Sniper uses auto assist, and it's still a power weapon and doesn't require that much skill ( point, aim, fire, at least that how I get my kills, and I've got an solidly positive k/d so I must be doing something right)

 

2) You will still get a power weapon or some other way to keep your advantage

 

3) Who said there weren't going to be weapons already on the map, and if there aren't that still doesn't take away the fact that ordinance drops are a problem. ( Ordinance System wouldn't be pointless if there were weapons on the map, to quote the others and yourself, "they would help to stop the camping" ( no they wouldn't )) You do realized you can camp outside right, you don't have to be indoors to camp. ( "sigh")

 

4) At least in the CURRENT ( previous, are you already playing Halo 4???) Halo Games players who get the power weapon only have so little time they can use it before it runs out, and after it runs out players have to wait for it to spawn back before they can go grab it, most players use their other non power weapons during this time ( do weapons not run out for you, are you playing matchmaking or custom games???), and so what you're saying is with the ordinance drop skill will become," Is My Rocket Launcher better then your Sniper Rifle" (or overshield,or other power weapon or special ability).

 

5) You're Repeating the same response all over again ( I just copied and pasted your previous post there), but I have to because your repeating the same arguments/questions. This is becoming more about people trying to prove me wrong then being informative ( The forums are funny that way).

 

I didn't know I have to agree with you and can't voice my own opinion on THE COMMUNITY FORUM ( I'm pretty sure I've played Halo enough to voice my opinion on this forum). I'm not complaining, I'm just stating the opinion of me and some of my friends. People like you are part of the reason we don't usually speak on the forums, you start turning it into a persuasive discussion instead of an informative one when people say something against an idea of 343s or an idea of your own. I'm not trying to change your ideas, I'm only informing you all and 343 ( if they're reading) on me and many other people I know in the Halo community of our opinion. If you don't like it don't read it.

 

While I'm Reading The Posts http://i.imgur.com/tCp90.gif

[Zuko 'Zarhamee]

According to the most recent bulletin on halo Waypoint, the strongest power weapons (Rockets, Sniper, etc) will not be in Ordinance drops. Players will only get mid-level power weapons not high-power ones.