Boltshot is not OP

[SatanicBagels]

Throughout the history of the Halo franchise there have been quite a few OP weapons but the Halo 4 Boltshot is not one of them. I'm willing to bet that the majority of people who are on here complaining about the Boltshot were recently killed by it and decided they needed a place to rage... However, when you look at it with a level head the Boltshot is not OP at all. At least not OP unless you want to consider the Plasma Pistol and double Melee OP as well.

 

Despite what people seem to be saying the range that one can realistically get a one shot on somebody with the Boltshot is very small and just shy from being point blank. The videos I have seen of people getting one shots with the Boltshot from 10 feet away were very good shots and deserving of it. We're talking about landing all 5 shots in the head despite the ridiculously large spread.

 

So assuming that the Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee distance then you have to ask yourself what makes it different from the Plasma Pistol + DMR/BR combo. It this regard the Plasma Pistol is even more powerful because it has a range that spans far more vast distances. Also you have to look at the effect that Sprint has had on the double melee. Since one can rack up a double melee kill so quickly now it's really not fair to call the Boltshot OP without calling Sprint OP.

 

So here is the facts that balance the Boltshot...

 

*Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee range.

*Have to charge the shots and cannot hold for anything but a short period of time. (Requires good timing)

*Grenades, Promethean Vision, Taking wide berths when going around a corner all render the Boltshot ineffective.

*If you don't get the one shot you are genuinely screwed.

*Charged shot takes up half of the clip and causes a small cooldown before any follow up shots.

[Admiral Ackbar]

Couldn't agree more it's not over powered. I see a lot of people complaining about the Boltshot, but I never see anyone use it..

[OMG Treason]

I agree, I think ive only been killed by it maybe 7 times, and when i try to use it its just terrible.

 

Good post my friend.

[Xxlittlegrunt4u]

Not to mention that it makes a very loud sound while charging (Thats the part where you back up xD). I for one dont use it because i just like the feeling of the magnum, but there is a funny counter for it.

 

If you pop hardlight sheild and they fire the boltshot charged... the shot bounces off the shield. I have blocked so many boltshots with hardlight that if i notice a pattern in a match that is my armour ability of choice. Funny how there isnt one complainer yet on this post...

[Dawn Wolf]

Eh, there's some pretty good counter arguments to your points. I'm still on the fence about it being OP. I'll present the other side.

 

 

At least not OP unless you want to consider the Plasma Pistol and double Melee OP as well.

 

 

So assuming that the Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee distance then you have to ask yourself what makes it different from the Plasma Pistol + DMR/BR combo. It this regard the Plasma Pistol is even more powerful because it has a range that spans far more vast distances

 

Here's the thing. Halo (Especially 4) is a game where milliseconds count. They make all the difference. That's why people consider the DMR OP. It's ONLY OP by a few milliseconds behind the other weapons. It's why shotguns users win at CQC often time against other weapons. So the DMR can kill in 1.5 seconds. So the PP can kill in a melee. Doesn't matter when something is a one shot. What makes the Boltshot questionable is that it kills instantly. No other loadout weapon does this. What this means is that:

 

You can often be one shot from losing a duel, head into cover for just a brief second, and jump out for a one shot kill as soon as the other player steps within the danger zone. You can actually HUNT down sword users (Esp. with P V), and with the proper skill, mercilessly force them into CQC, and counter their power weapon.

 

You can get some crazy double kills by jumping around people whilst charging the thing. That other weapons would not grant you.

 

Then there's the prospect of the full auto weapons. The Boltshot really does make these already underpowered weapons have another horrible disadvantage. It's hard to want to get as close as you can when everyone is using this thing.

 

 

*Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee range.

*Have to charge the shots and cannot hold for anything but a short period of time. (Requires good timing)

*Grenades, Promethean Vision, Taking wide berths when going around a corner all render the Boltshot ineffective.

*If you don't get the one shot you are genuinely screwed.

*Charged shot takes up half of the clip and causes a small cooldown before any follow up shots.

 

-It's a decent distance away. About the distance a Scattershot needs to one shot someone, or a sword lunge. Think about that. A loadout weapon has the same POTENTIAL killing power as the sword. Less than the shotgun of course.

-You have a decent window for timing the shot before it autofires. If, for example, this window was gone, and you had to wait for the gun to fire, it would change everything.

-It's hard to grenade someone if you are out, or if you aren't aware they are there. And they're dodgable/survivable. P Vision makes Boltshot that much better. It's very useful with one. Against a Boltshot, I don't know. Just because you see someone in the heat of battle doesen't mean you'll notice the tiny little weapon they have. And people cant always give something a wide berth, there are plenty of times one would be "forced" into the boltshot, just as with any other melee power weapon.

-You can still miss the one shot and duck back into cover to either do another charge or swap weapons. It's not that much of a death sentence. If the enemy is one shot, you can even start spraying with the boltshot.

-We would hope the weapon would garner SOME disadvantage for the power it has. Yes its a risk to use it, but that doesn't always offset something's power. It's also a "risk" to use the sniper.

 

Overall, I use it a lot. I get a pretty high amount of kills with it. Does it get me killed sometimes? Sure. But the potential for winning situations you should have NO chance of winning is there. Is this completely a bad thing? Not sure. But generally on smaller, 4v4 maps, I see no reason NOT to take the boltshot. And that's often the definition of OP. It's complicated, for sure.

[Zuko 'Zarhamee]

The boltshot is no more OP than the Plasma Pistol or the Magnum. The Plasma Pistol also has the ability to kill instantly if you time the melee right. The magnum has longer range than the other secondary weapons. And the automatic weapons have a range much greater than the boltshot's overcharge, making them an effective counter.

[SatanicBagels]

-It's a decent distance away. About the distance a Scattershot needs to one shot someone, or a sword lunge. Think about that. A loadout weapon has the same POTENTIAL killing power as the sword. Less than the shotgun of course.

-You have a decent window for timing the shot before it autofires. If, for example, this window was gone, and you had to wait for the gun to fire, it would change everything.

-It's hard to grenade someone if you are out, or if you aren't aware they are there. And they're dodgable/survivable. P Vision makes Boltshot that much better. It's very useful with one. Against a Boltshot, I don't know. Just because you see someone in the heat of battle doesen't mean you'll notice the tiny little weapon they have. And people cant always give something a wide berth, there are plenty of times one would be "forced" into the boltshot, just as with any other melee power weapon.

-You can still miss the one shot and duck back into cover to either do another charge or swap weapons. It's not that much of a death sentence. If the enemy is one shot, you can even start spraying with the boltshot.

-We would hope the weapon would garner SOME disadvantage for the power it has. Yes its a risk to use it, but that doesn't always offset something's power. It's also a "risk" to use the sniper.

 

Overall, I use it a lot. I get a pretty high amount of kills with it. Does it get me killed sometimes? Sure. But the potential for winning situations you should have NO chance of winning is there. Is this completely a bad thing? Not sure. But generally on smaller, 4v4 maps, I see no reason NOT to take the boltshot. And that's often the definition of OP. It's complicated, for sure.

 

The Boltshot does not have the same effective distance as a Scattershot or a shotgun. At 5 forge blocks away the Boltshot does the same amount of damage (2/3 of shields) as the Scattershot at 8 blocks away, and that is not factoring in the fact that the Boltshot has a cooldown, requires good timing, and makes a loud warning noise before firing.

 

The argument about times to kill isn't valid though because that's not what matters. They can balance weapons in other ways than TTK as they have done very well with the boltshot.

[Bloody Initiate]

I have been killed by people who were pretty good with the boltshot. In my head I congratulated them. It's not OP. It required a charge up, which already disqualifies it from being OP, fyi, and close range, which further disqualifies it, and finally it has two shots before reloading (after you charge up for each). The amount of time you spend unable to fire this weapon in a threatening way is enormous.

 

Charge-ups are just weaker because they can't rise to the occasion. The closest to OP a charge-up weapon in Halo has been was the Halo 3 Spartan Laser, and it wasn't OP it was just stupidly important. You absolutely had to have the laser if you wanted to run vehicles. If you didn't have it, you were doomed. It was a lack of other options that doomed you, not the power of the laser. Then they nerfed it super hard in Reach (Rockets did more damage, which was dumb) and finally in Halo 4 they've weakened vehicles enough and given you so many alternatives that you can run a strategy that doesn't involve a laser (where in Halo 3 you couldn't). It was a similar situation in Reach, but better balanced now. Also they made its sound and light effects much less satisfying, a highly relevant complaint.

 

CQC weapons generally can't be OP because CQC requires you to close the distance, and in the time it takes you to do that you can be shot to hell. In a game with powerful CQC weapons people either camp or keep their distance, this gives everyone else a choice to not encounter them when they're strongest. A sword lunge across the map a la Halo 2 is NOT a CQC weapon.

 

Reload/recharging/cooling down is another weakness, but not one that absolutely disqualifies a weapon from being OP.

 

The boltshot is not anywhere near the league of importance or power as other such weapons. It's just a nifty pistol. I can kill someone instantly, with any loadout, by hitting them in the back. That doesn't make beat downs OP, it makes them subject to a highly restrictive set of circumstances.

[snqrls]

I have been killed by people who were pretty good with the boltshot. In my head I congratulated them. It's not OP. It required a charge up, which already disqualifies it from being OP, fyi, and close range, which further disqualifies it, and finally it has two shots before reloading (after you charge up for each). The amount of time you spend unable to fire this weapon in a threatening way is enormous.

 

Charge-ups are just weaker because they can't rise to the occasion. The closest to OP a charge-up weapon in Halo has been was the Halo 3 Spartan Laser, and it wasn't OP it was just stupidly important. You absolutely had to have the laser if you wanted to run vehicles. If you didn't have it, you were doomed. It was a lack of other options that doomed you, not the power of the laser. Then they nerfed it super hard in Reach (Rockets did more damage, which was dumb) and finally in Halo 4 they've weakened vehicles enough and given you so many alternatives that you can run a strategy that doesn't involve a laser (where in Halo 3 you couldn't). It was a similar situation in Reach, but better balanced now. Also they made its sound and light effects much less satisfying, a highly relevant complaint.

 

CQC weapons generally can't be OP because CQC requires you to close the distance, and in the time it takes you to do that you can be shot to hell. In a game with powerful CQC weapons people either camp or keep their distance, this gives everyone else a choice to not encounter them when they're strongest. A sword lunge across the map a la Halo 2 is NOT a CQC weapon.

 

Reload/recharging/cooling down is another weakness, but not one that absolutely disqualifies a weapon from being OP.

 

The boltshot is not anywhere near the league of importance or power as other such weapons. It's just a nifty pistol. I can kill someone instantly, with any loadout, by hitting them in the back. That doesn't make beat downs OP, it makes them subject to a highly restrictive set of circumstances.

Well first off, it's very easy to use if you haven't already, but also, its effective range is a very big hole in your argument, and you seem to ignore it. There's simply too much utility in a map that supports camping for it to be ballanced.

 

That, and oddly enough it can beat automatic weapons, just like a shotgun given cqc range, even if there's no prior chargeup. Also, without PV, it's very hard, if not impossible to respond to campers in time to not die unless you have either a hardlight shield, a teamate nearby, or an assault rifle.

[Dawn Wolf]

Another thing you guys are forgetting about the Boltshot is that it's a secondary. This means that it is not at all a disadvantage to have it as a CQC weapon if you rock a DMR. People are not going to use the Boltshot at range. They'll pull it out for close range. The DMR is not a "counter" to it.

 

And again, there's a huge difference between charge shot plus melee, and charge shot instant kill.

 

I feel like I have killed way too many players with the Boltshot where I would have been doomed with any other loadout weapon. Guy has me one shot. Run behind cover. Ring around the rosy him. Pop out as he inevitably gets just a LITTLE too close and get the kill. Repeat with another guy 2 seconds later.

 

Yeah, this sort of advantage is fine for a power weapon. But a loud out weapon?

 

I'm not exactly complaining. I have fun with the thing. But I do kinda feel it might be slightly OP in the scheme of things.

[xSwAyZeyx]

[snqrls]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jxf6I_8upaU

 

How is this not irrelevant and shameless, self-plugging footage of yourself murdering noobs?

[FRANK NITTI]

Another thing you guys are forgetting about the Boltshot is that it's a secondary. This means that it is not at all a disadvantage to have it as a CQC weapon if you rock a DMR. People are not going to use the Boltshot at range. They'll pull it out for close range. The DMR is not a "counter" to it.

 

And again, there's a huge difference between charge shot plus melee, and charge shot instant kill.

 

I feel like I have killed way too many players with the Boltshot where I would have been doomed with any other loadout weapon. Guy has me one shot. Run behind cover. Ring around the rosy him. Pop out as he inevitably gets just a LITTLE too close and get the kill. Repeat with another guy 2 seconds later.

 

Yeah, this sort of advantage is fine for a power weapon. But a loud out weapon?

 

I'm not exactly complaining. I have fun with the thing. But I do kinda feel it might be slightly OP in the scheme of things.

 

 

You know what that's called, BAITING. You did exactly what a skilled player would in that situation. You guys must get something in your head, THERE ARE NO RULES ON ENGAGEMENT IN AN ONLINE SHOOTER. There are no rules of honor. We are all given a tooset and these tools all have a counter tool. If a weapon is truly OP, it will be acknowledged, weapons such as the Halo 1 pistol. However, unless someone is using real cheats aka via modified consoles etc, then anything else if fair game.

 

A person has to be willing to question whether their own reactions were the proper reactions for a given situation.

[SatanicBagels]

How is this not irrelevant and shameless, self-plugging footage of yourself murdering noobs?

 

He talks about his opinions on the boltshot. His ass smashing of noobs with the Scattershot is pretty good too though

[Kiing 0f Coffe]

You know what that's called, BAITING. You did exactly what a skilled player would in that situation. You guys must get something in your head, THERE ARE NO RULES ON ENGAGEMENT IN AN ONLINE SHOOTER. There are no rules of honor. We are all given a tooset and these tools all have a counter tool. If a weapon is truly OP, it will be acknowledged, weapons such as the Halo 1 pistol. However, unless someone is using real cheats aka via modified consoles etc, then anything else if fair game.

 

A person has to be willing to question whether their own reactions were the proper reactions for a given situation.

You know what that's called, BAITING. You did exactly what a skilled player would in that situation. You guys must get something in your head, THERE ARE NO RULES ON ENGAGEMENT IN AN ONLINE SHOOTER. There are no rules of honor. We are all given a tooset and these tools all have a counter tool. If a weapon is truly OP, it will be acknowledged, weapons such as the Halo 1 pistol. However, unless someone is using real cheats aka via modified consoles etc, then anything else if fair game.

 

A person has to be willing to question whether their own reactions were the proper reactions for a given situation.

Sometimes, you are forced to fall prey to the boltshot. The maps have some CQB situations that getting killed by the gun is impossible unless you happen to have hardlight shield. This shotgun element from COD doesn't belong in halo.

 

The Boltshot does not have the same effective distance as a Scattershot or a shotgun. At 5 forge blocks away the Boltshot does the same amount of damage (2/3 of shields) as the Scattershot at 8 blocks away, and that is not factoring in the fact that the Boltshot has a cooldown, requires good timing, and makes a loud warning noise before firing.

 

The argument about times to kill isn't valid though because that's not what matters. They can balance weapons in other ways than TTK as they have done very well with the boltshot.

The Boltshot does not have the same effective distance as a Scattershot or a shotgun. At 5 forge blocks away the Boltshot does the same amount of damage (2/3 of shields) as the Scattershot at 8 blocks away, and that is not factoring in the fact that the Boltshot has a cooldown, requires good timing, and makes a loud warning noise before firing.

 

The argument about times to kill isn't valid though because that's not what matters. They can balance weapons in other ways than TTK as they have done very well with the boltshot.

The boltshot has a longer 1-hit range than the shotgun or the scatter. This would be fine if it wasn't a secondary weapon.

 

I have been killed by people who were pretty good with the boltshot. In my head I congratulated them. It's not OP. It required a charge up, which already disqualifies it from being OP, fyi, and close range, which further disqualifies it, and finally it has two shots before reloading (after you charge up for each). The amount of time you spend unable to fire this weapon in a threatening way is enormous.

 

Charge-ups are just weaker because they can't rise to the occasion. The closest to OP a charge-up weapon in Halo has been was the Halo 3 Spartan Laser, and it wasn't OP it was just stupidly important. You absolutely had to have the laser if you wanted to run vehicles. If you didn't have it, you were doomed. It was a lack of other options that doomed you, not the power of the laser. Then they nerfed it super hard in Reach (Rockets did more damage, which was dumb) and finally in Halo 4 they've weakened vehicles enough and given you so many alternatives that you can run a strategy that doesn't involve a laser (where in Halo 3 you couldn't). It was a similar situation in Reach, but better balanced now. Also they made its sound and light effects much less satisfying, a highly relevant complaint.

 

CQC weapons generally can't be OP because CQC requires you to close the distance, and in the time it takes you to do that you can be shot to hell. In a game with powerful CQC weapons people either camp or keep their distance, this gives everyone else a choice to not encounter them when they're strongest. A sword lunge across the map a la Halo 2 is NOT a CQC weapon.

 

Reload/recharging/cooling down is another weakness, but not one that absolutely disqualifies a weapon from being OP.

 

The boltshot is not anywhere near the league of importance or power as other such weapons. It's just a nifty pistol. I can kill someone instantly, with any loadout, by hitting them in the back. That doesn't make beat downs OP, it makes them subject to a highly restrictive set of circumstances.

I have been killed by people who were pretty good with the boltshot. In my head I congratulated them. It's not OP. It required a charge up, which already disqualifies it from being OP, fyi, and close range, which further disqualifies it, and finally it has two shots before reloading (after you charge up for each). The amount of time you spend unable to fire this weapon in a threatening way is enormous.

 

Charge-ups are just weaker because they can't rise to the occasion. The closest to OP a charge-up weapon in Halo has been was the Halo 3 Spartan Laser, and it wasn't OP it was just stupidly important. You absolutely had to have the laser if you wanted to run vehicles. If you didn't have it, you were doomed. It was a lack of other options that doomed you, not the power of the laser. Then they nerfed it super hard in Reach (Rockets did more damage, which was dumb) and finally in Halo 4 they've weakened vehicles enough and given you so many alternatives that you can run a strategy that doesn't involve a laser (where in Halo 3 you couldn't). It was a similar situation in Reach, but better balanced now. Also they made its sound and light effects much less satisfying, a highly relevant complaint.

 

CQC weapons generally can't be OP because CQC requires you to close the distance, and in the time it takes you to do that you can be shot to hell. In a game with powerful CQC weapons people either camp or keep their distance, this gives everyone else a choice to not encounter them when they're strongest. A sword lunge across the map a la Halo 2 is NOT a CQC weapon.

 

Reload/recharging/cooling down is another weakness, but not one that absolutely disqualifies a weapon from being OP.

 

The boltshot is not anywhere near the league of importance or power as other such weapons. It's just a nifty pistol. I can kill someone instantly, with any loadout, by hitting them in the back. That doesn't make beat downs OP, it makes them subject to a highly restrictive set of circumstances.

The reason the Splaser wasn't OP was because you couldn't start out with the thing. The boltshot would be fine if it wasn't a secondary.

 

Throughout the history of the Halo franchise there have been quite a few OP weapons but the Halo 4 Boltshot is not one of them. I'm willing to bet that the majority of people who are on here complaining about the Boltshot were recently killed by it and decided they needed a place to rage... However, when you look at it with a level head the Boltshot is not OP at all. At least not OP unless you want to consider the Plasma Pistol and double Melee OP as well.

 

Despite what people seem to be saying the range that one can realistically get a one shot on somebody with the Boltshot is very small and just shy from being point blank. The videos I have seen of people getting one shots with the Boltshot from 10 feet away were very good shots and deserving of it. We're talking about landing all 5 shots in the head despite the ridiculously large spread.

 

So assuming that the Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee distance then you have to ask yourself what makes it different from the Plasma Pistol + DMR/BR combo. It this regard the Plasma Pistol is even more powerful because it has a range that spans far more vast distances. Also you have to look at the effect that Sprint has had on the double melee. Since one can rack up a double melee kill so quickly now it's really not fair to call the Boltshot OP without calling Sprint OP.

 

So here is the facts that balance the Boltshot...

 

*Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee range.

*Have to charge the shots and cannot hold for anything but a short period of time. (Requires good timing)

*Grenades, Promethean Vision, Taking wide berths when going around a corner all render the Boltshot ineffective.

*If you don't get the one shot you are genuinely screwed.

*Charged shot takes up half of the clip and causes a small cooldown before any follow up shots.

Throughout the history of the Halo franchise there have been quite a few OP weapons but the Halo 4 Boltshot is not one of them. I'm willing to bet that the majority of people who are on here complaining about the Boltshot were recently killed by it and decided they needed a place to rage... However, when you look at it with a level head the Boltshot is not OP at all. At least not OP unless you want to consider the Plasma Pistol and double Melee OP as well.

 

Despite what people seem to be saying the range that one can realistically get a one shot on somebody with the Boltshot is very small and just shy from being point blank. The videos I have seen of people getting one shots with the Boltshot from 10 feet away were very good shots and deserving of it. We're talking about landing all 5 shots in the head despite the ridiculously large spread.

 

So assuming that the Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee distance then you have to ask yourself what makes it different from the Plasma Pistol + DMR/BR combo. It this regard the Plasma Pistol is even more powerful because it has a range that spans far more vast distances. Also you have to look at the effect that Sprint has had on the double melee. Since one can rack up a double melee kill so quickly now it's really not fair to call the Boltshot OP without calling Sprint OP.

 

So here is the facts that balance the Boltshot...

 

*Boltshot is only feasibly one-shot at just outside of melee range.

*Have to charge the shots and cannot hold for anything but a short period of time. (Requires good timing)

*Grenades, Promethean Vision, Taking wide berths when going around a corner all render the Boltshot ineffective.

*If you don't get the one shot you are genuinely screwed.

*Charged shot takes up half of the clip and causes a small cooldown before any follow up shots.

About the plasma pistol mele, the mele range in this game is super small, and at a distance you can easily dodge the plasma pistol EMP.

[Dawn Wolf]

You know what that's called, BAITING. You did exactly what a skilled player would in that situation. You guys must get something in your head, THERE ARE NO RULES ON ENGAGEMENT IN AN ONLINE SHOOTER. There are no rules of honor. We are all given a tooset and these tools all have a counter tool. If a weapon is truly OP, it will be acknowledged, weapons such as the Halo 1 pistol. However, unless someone is using real cheats aka via modified consoles etc, then anything else if fair game.

 

A person has to be willing to question whether their own reactions were the proper reactions for a given situation.

 

Yes, I realize that. Im a competitive guy, I support the "adapt or die" philosophy. But this is a matchmaking discussion, and this is the place to consider if weapons are broken or not. It's a fine line after all, right?

 

If the DMR killed in 4 shots instead of 5 (lol), people would be even more so angry and talking about how OP it is.

 

If the Boltshot's charged shot could be held indefinitely and had the range and power of the shotgun, even more people would call it OP.

 

What I'm saying is that even though I "deserved" the kill in the proposed situation, it wouldn't be possible with any other weapon.

 

The definition of OP is not necessarily "Breaks the game", but "Significantly more powerful than the alternatives". At this point, if you're not running big team, or a sprayer primary, I think the advantages of the Boltshot are huge. I'm not whining about it, I'm just stating that I could see this being a problem in some ways. I use the thing, personally, I am fine with keeping it as is.

 

Even though weapons will always rise to the top, variety is nice. And in H4, it feels like the DMR/BS/PV class is going to simply dominate the game. Not saying people don't use the BR and other weapons, and that they aren't perfectly viable, but I feel surprised that the BS is as good as it is.

[Bloody Initiate]

First I'd like to say, as I often do in game balance discussions, that usually when something is being called overpowered it's because the alternatives are actually UNDER powered.

 

People will always complain about campers. They always look silly doing it. The camping strategy gets better and better the less the game allows you to slow down and think, but this game also lets you see through walls, so I don't really sympathize with anyone who can't handle a camper. "But he had camo!" well camo still lets everyone know you're using it by radar jamming and in Halo 4 there's a specific sound effect that goes with the cloaking effect. Most camo guys use it in the open so that they can get the first shot on you (which wins the fight in an even contest), they don't usually use it to fool Promethean Vision.

 

The only time campers give me problems are when everyone else on the map is feeding them kills by being stupid, and I have to compete with with their score when everyone is trying their best to make them win. Here's a tip: Stay the hell away from a fight someone has set up for you.

 

As for how the Boltshot owns Automatic Weapons: EVERYTHING OWNS AUTOMATIC WEAPONS! The only decent automatic weapon is the SAW. The needler can do a bit of work in the right circumstances. The AR, Storm Rifle, and Suppressor all suck and have always sucked. Bungie and 343 both hate automatic weapons, why else would they make sure they sucked so badly in every game? I don't like it, but it's the truth. It doesn't mean every weapon that can destroy them is OP, it means they're Underpowered because every weapon can destroy them.

 

I have never seen someone win a game because they had a boltshot. It's not OP, it's the one friggen CQC weapon that you can start with that does its job. You DO get owned by boltshots when you have an AR, because the AR sucks not because the boltshot is OP. And you get owned by campers because you're so busy getting a rush out of sprinting around every corner that you'd get owned by anyone who has a motion tracker (Hint: That's everyone).

 

Don't sprint around corners, don't approach areas you know campers are, and don't get close to ANYONE because the closer you get the closer you are to trading kills, which is bad unless you're already losing that fight. Keep your distance, and try running Promethean Vision for just a couple games so you can see how in EVERY GAME there is at least one or two occasions when someone is crouching around the corner. Seriously, I see it in every game. I bounce a frag around to get them to back off, and if they don't then another frag is already on its way.

 

People still get me with the boltshot every now and then, but not nearly with the frequency they would if it was actually an OP weapon. You don't get close to ANYONE if you have a choice, because the closer you are the more costly the fight will be, even if you win. I melee sword guys when they take me down so that if a teammate of mine comes around the corner they're one-shot. That's CQC, it's tougher and riskier. Avoid it at all costs unless you're already losing the fight. Any weapon that is meant for CQC should have a faster kill time than a weapon meant for mid-range, because if you don't end a close-range fight fast then you're going to end it in pieces.

[Cortar]

Boltshot is OP because you can SPAWN with it. You shouldn't be able to spawn with the plasma pistol or the boltshot. They should be on the map likes how weapons SHOULD be found.

[Bloody Initiate]

Who the hell is going to run to the the boltshot or plasma pistol spawn like it's a power weapon? You don't see people making a mad dash for the needler now, and it has actually been good the last few games. Power weapons are not all created equal, and the needler is not a power weapon, yet it's better than both the plasma pistol and the boltshot.

 

You should be able to start with the boltshot because it's one of the few secondary weapons that does its job. I find the plasma pistol EMP combo doesn't work as well now that it takes longer to switch wepaons. I use it in my BTB loadout to stop vehicles, but it's not fast enough for the EMP combo anymore.

 

Furthermore the weapon drops are already terrible. How often have you felt like you were getting screwed by your ordnance drop because the best thing in it was a needler while the guy on the other team got a binary rifle from his? He got his ordnance drop from racking up kills with the rocket launcher or incineration cannon while you got yours by fightng like hell with your DMR. The good drops are already extremely rare, the last thing I want is for the stupid boltshot or the plasma pistol to suddenly appear making it even LESS likely that I'll get what I want.

 

I don't want anything about the boltshot changed. I want the primary automatic weapons to be better so that they don't get crudely violated by a stupid pistol.

[Twinreaper]

While I normally wouldnt agree with it being OP, just tha fact that that spawning with it, and the easily doable reload glitch, make this weapon a major hassle. I get it... not everyone uses the glitch, but it only takes a few to ruin it for everyone.

[snqrls]

To the video. YEah, sorry lol, I had the sound off.

First I'd like to say, as I often do in game balance discussions, that usually when something is being called overpowered it's because the alternatives are actually UNDER powered.

 

People will always complain about campers. They always look silly doing it. The camping strategy gets better and better the less the game allows you to slow down and think, but this game also lets you see through walls, so I don't really sympathize with anyone who can't handle a camper. "But he had camo!" well camo still lets everyone know you're using it by radar jamming and in Halo 4 there's a specific sound effect that goes with the cloaking effect. Most camo guys use it in the open so that they can get the first shot on you (which wins the fight in an even contest), they don't usually use it to fool Promethean Vision.

 

The only time campers give me problems are when everyone else on the map is feeding them kills by being stupid, and I have to compete with with their score when everyone is trying their best to make them win. Here's a tip: Stay the hell away from a fight someone has set up for you.

 

As for how the Boltshot owns Automatic Weapons: EVERYTHING OWNS AUTOMATIC WEAPONS! The only decent automatic weapon is the SAW. The needler can do a bit of work in the right circumstances. The AR, Storm Rifle, and Suppressor all suck and have always sucked. Bungie and 343 both hate automatic weapons, why else would they make sure they sucked so badly in every game? I don't like it, but it's the truth. It doesn't mean every weapon that can destroy them is OP, it means they're Underpowered because every weapon can destroy them.

 

I have never seen someone win a game because they had a boltshot. It's not OP, it's the one friggen CQC weapon that you can start with that does its job. You DO get owned by boltshots when you have an AR, because the AR sucks not because the boltshot is OP. And you get owned by campers because you're so busy getting a rush out of sprinting around every corner that you'd get owned by anyone who has a motion tracker (Hint: That's everyone).

 

Don't sprint around corners, don't approach areas you know campers are, and don't get close to ANYONE because the closer you get the closer you are to trading kills, which is bad unless you're already losing that fight. Keep your distance, and try running Promethean Vision for just a couple games so you can see how in EVERY GAME there is at least one or two occasions when someone is crouching around the corner. Seriously, I see it in every game. I bounce a frag around to get them to back off, and if they don't then another frag is already on its way.

 

People still get me with the boltshot every now and then, but not nearly with the frequency they would if it was actually an OP weapon. You don't get close to ANYONE if you have a choice, because the closer you are the more costly the fight will be, even if you win. I melee sword guys when they take me down so that if a teammate of mine comes around the corner they're one-shot. That's CQC, it's tougher and riskier. Avoid it at all costs unless you're already losing the fight. Any weapon that is meant for CQC should have a faster kill time than a weapon meant for mid-range, because if you don't end a close-range fight fast then you're going to end it in pieces.

 

First off, the automatic weapons have similar kill times to the dmr at their effective range. Utility weapons should give you a fighting chance regardless, but saying the assault rifle is under powered despite it's something like 1.7 second kill time is terribly dumb.

 

Now as to camping, yes, you can respond to it with solid teamwork even on rather closed maps like adrift, but it stagnates gameplay, cause there's really no effective way to break them without taking on some considerable risk. That the boltshot allows people to camp so effectively despite everyone spawning with two grenades is destructive to both other loadouts, and to gameplay on maps like adrift and complex. On solace, the insufficient warning, and the lack of response time to a charged boltshot is stifling to say the least, but because of the open terrain and numerous pathways, it's not nearly as large a deal even though there's no possible way PV can make itself useful unless its an objective gametype.

[Cortar]

Who the hell is going to run to the the boltshot or plasma pistol spawn like it's a power weapon? You don't see people making a mad dash for the needler now, and it has actually been good the last few games. Power weapons are not all created equal, and the needler is not a power weapon, yet it's better than both the plasma pistol and the boltshot.

 

Exactly, some are really,really good like the rocket launcher, and some are just okay like the needler, thank you for agreeing with me!

 

Anyways, the brute mauler was basically the same thing as the boltshot except the bs is more difficult to use correclty.

 

You should be able to start with the boltshot because it's one of the few secondary weapons that does its job. I find the plasma pistol EMP combo doesn't work as well now that it takes longer to switch wepaons. I use it in my BTB loadout to stop vehicles, but it's not fast enough for the EMP combo anymore.

 

You shouldn't be able to spawn with the plamsa pistol either....

Furthermore the weapon drops are already terrible. How often have you felt like you were getting screwed by your ordnance drop because the best thing in it was a needler while the guy on the other team got a binary rifle from his? He got his ordnance drop from racking up kills with the rocket launcher or incineration cannon while you got yours by fightng like hell with your DMR. The good drops are already extremely rare, the last thing I want is for the stupid boltshot or the plasma pistol to suddenly appear making it even LESS likely that I'll get what I want.

Or maybe they could just spawn on the map!!! What a crazy and new idea!!!! You don't even have to get rid of those retarded POD to implement this!!!! Wth what a crazy idea!

 

I don't want anything about the boltshot changed. I want the primary automatic weapons to be better so that they don't get crudely violated by a stupid pistol.

Na, they are already too powerful enough, at least the bs keeps them in check at bit so AR scrubs can't get that many easy kills

[Bloody Initiate]

First off, the automatic weapons have similar kill times to the dmr at their effective range. Utility weapons should give you a fighting chance regardless, but saying the assault rifle is under powered despite it's something like 1.7 second kill time is terribly dumb.

 

Why should it take 1.7 seconds to kill at close range when there are several weapons that kill you instantly at that range?

 

Let's be perfectly clear on a very important fact about guns in Halo: Their bullets all do the same damage at all ranges. Your kill time with the DMR at 100 yards is exactly the same as your kill time at 1 yard. It's harder to land the shots, but if you land them they die just the same.

 

So the AR should have a much faster kill time than the DMR at its effective range. I know the idea of a weapon performing better at the range it was designed for is hard for you to believe, but that's how it's supposed to work. The AR should kill faster because its accuracy and recoil keep it from being effective at mid-to-long range. So when you're up close with an AR user and you have your DMR, you should die before you can get 5 shots off because you made the mistake of letting them get that close. If you use a DMR in CQC, you deserve to die. If you use an AR at mid-to-long range, you deserve to die.

 

If the AR worked like it should you would have already learned this lesson and I wouldn't have to explain this to people over and over and over again. Instead ARs have been underpowered for so long that people really believe that ARs just don't deserve to win fights at any range, ever. THAT'S "terribly dumb." If you think the AR should just lose every fight, then just say "I hate ARs" and get it over with so those of us who want to discuss it seriously can do so.

 

Back on topic, I'll just re-iterate that if the automatic primary weapons weren't so friggen miserable than the boltshot wouldn't seem so impressive.

[xSwAyZeyx]

How is this not irrelevant and shameless, self-plugging footage of yourself murdering noobs?

Boltshot discussion in commentary sir dont misslead yourself

[snqrls]

Why should it take 1.7 seconds to kill at close range when there are several weapons that kill you instantly at that range?

 

Let's be perfectly clear on a very important fact about guns in Halo: Their bullets all do the same damage at all ranges. Your kill time with the DMR at 100 yards is exactly the same as your kill time at 1 yard. It's harder to land the shots, but if you land them they die just the same.

 

So the AR should have a much faster kill time than the DMR at its effective range. I know the idea of a weapon performing better at the range it was designed for is hard for you to believe, but that's how it's supposed to work. The AR should kill faster because its accuracy and recoil keep it from being effective at mid-to-long range. So when you're up close with an AR user and you have your DMR, you should die before you can get 5 shots off because you made the mistake of letting them get that close. If you use a DMR in CQC, you deserve to die. If you use an AR at mid-to-long range, you deserve to die.

 

If the AR worked like it should you would have already learned this lesson and I wouldn't have to explain this to people over and over and over again. Instead ARs have been underpowered for so long that people really believe that ARs just don't deserve to win fights at any range, ever. THAT'S "terribly dumb." If you think the AR should just lose every fight, then just say "I hate ARs" and get it over with so those of us who want to discuss it seriously can do so.

 

Back on topic, I'll just re-iterate that if the automatic primary weapons weren't so friggen miserable than the boltshot wouldn't seem so impressive.

 

Okay, so your entire post ignores the actual issue, whatever, but hold up, are you trying to supplement your argument with something irrelevant already.... look, the only loadout weapon which can do that is the boltshot, so your point here only detracts from your overall position.

 

Anyway.... arguably the only difference between a dmr and an assault rifle is with one it takes skill to get up close to use it effectively, and with the other it takes skill to aim effectively. For different levels this will mean very different things for game ballancing. At the lower ranks for instance, assault rifles will show up frequently since the best kll time the players can manage with a utility weapon is far longer than the best case scenario.

 

In the end, the automatics aren't ballanced by how much damage they do, but how easy they are to handle up close. And the reason why the assualt rifle has roughly the same killtime as the dmr is because its ease of use in cqc ballances out its lack of utility. Ultimately, you're overestimating just how much a small effective-range means when we have tons of places on 4v4 and btb alike to take advantage of having an automatic weapon. Not to say it's easier than in past sandboxes, since there is some damage to compensate, but it doesn't need a buff either.

 

Now, of course I'd approve of harder to use automatics in exchange for more damage, but then that's a little difficult for 343 to do. Besides, as is, I think the supressor and storm rifle can kill even faster than the assault rifle.