Weapon balancing

[Jerry]

As you read the title you propably know what this is about, you can post anything related to the weapons here if you think they ar OP or UP etc. But before posting anything I would like you to read this and commenting your opinion about what I think.

 

 

Boltshot

Every secondary weapon has it own "specialisation", magnum has a zoom, plasma pistol have EMP and bolt shot shotgun shot. But the shotgun shot is sometimes a bit OP because it can too easily win a sword or a shotgun (which are power weapons), because the range of the shot is too long, I think it would be better if it was like melee range instant kill and if it were in the same range as a normal shotgun it would just take some shield. After all its a starting weapon not a power weapon

 

DMR

I have been experimenting with the DMR's bloom and auto aim. Which i then found out that it is too easy to use compared with the other weapons. What i mean is, that the bloom does not work as it supposed to work, for example: if you aim with the bigger circles edge on the head of your opponent it will still count as a head shot. Also if you are a bit further away from "short range" and you have a automatic weapon vs a DMR, the DMR will most often come out victorious.

If you look at the story behind the DMR i don't see why it even is on Reqium. So why couldn't they just leave this weapon back in reach?

I know it was meant to be two short - mid range weapons (BR and Carbine) and two mid - long range weapons (DMR and Lightrifle) But what would it hurt if they left out the DMR from the game and just made three mid range weapons. I think the DMR pretty much ruins the gameplay in Ragnarok, which was one of the best maps in Halo 3, and other big maps.

 

Automatic weapons

Storm rifle, supressor and assault rifle, are all weapons a like to use. Though the range of them is very short, if you try to use them against a mid range weapon in a bit longer situation then a cqb you are often pretty screwed. So the bloom of these weapons shouldnt be so big.

 

Plasma pistol

In know the PP is mostly meant for stunning vehicles, but i really enjoyed killing people with it in reach since it was very powerful there. But now in halo 4 it kills with 13 shots (I dont remember exactly but for example 13) and it over heats with 12. It is also really hard to hit every 13 shots so its often 15 shots you have to fire to kill which means you have to let it cool down one second in the middle of the battle. I don't know if 343 really meant it to be like this but it is really hard to win a pvp fight with the PP if the opponent have another weapon, so the only way to get kills with it is to kill players with no shield or suprise them from behind. So how are you supposed to get the PP commendation 7/7 if you can't kill with it properly?

 

 

After all I think 343i have made a good job balancing the weapons compared to the previous halos.

[Jersey Jackhawk]

You really do make some good points here, the paragraphs on the DMR made me laugh, but down to serious talk, the DMR is just too OP it needs to be balanced now or I'm afraid to say it but 343 are going to lose people to other games. Please balance the DMR 343 because its killing halo 4 and its a shame to see what amazing work you did on this game go to waste of one OP gun.

[RedStarRocket91]

As you read the title you propably know what this is about, you can post anything related to the weapons here if you think they ar OP or UP etc. But before posting anything I would like you to read this and commenting your opinion about what I think.

 

 

Boltshot

Every secondary weapon has it own "specialisation", magnum has a zoom, plasma pistol have EMP and bolt shot shotgun shot. But the shotgun shot is sometimes a bit OP because it can too easily win a sword or a shotgun (which are power weapons), because the range of the shot is too long, I think it would be better if it was like melee range instant kill and if it were in the same range as a normal shotgun it would just take some shield. After all its a starting weapon not a power weapon

 

DMR

I have been experimenting with the DMR's bloom and auto aim. Which i then found out that it is too easy to use compared with the other weapons. What i mean is, that the bloom does not work as it supposed to work, for example: if you aim with the bigger circles edge on the head of your opponent it will still count as a head shot. Also if you are a bit further away from "short range" and you have a automatic weapon vs a DMR, the DMR will most often come out victorious.

If you look at the story behind the DMR i don't see why it even is on Reqium. So why couldn't they just leave this weapon back in reach?

I know it was meant to be two short - mid range weapons (BR and Carbine) and two mid - long range weapons (DMR and Lightrifle) But what would it hurt if they left out the DMR from the game and just made three mid range weapons. I think the DMR pretty much ruins the gameplay in Ragnarok, which was one of the best maps in Halo 3, and other big maps.

 

Automatic weapons

Storm rifle, supressor and assault rifle, are all weapons a like to use. Though the range of them is very short, if you try to use them against a mid range weapon in a bit longer situation then a cqb you are often pretty screwed. So the bloom of these weapons shouldnt be so big.

 

Plasma pistol

In know the PP is mostly meant for stunning vehicles, but i really enjoyed killing people with it in reach since it was very powerful there. But now in halo 4 it kills with 13 shots (I dont remember exactly but for example 13) and it over heats with 12. It is also really hard to hit every 13 shots so its often 15 shots you have to fire to kill which means you have to let it cool down one second in the middle of the battle. I don't know if 343 really meant it to be like this but it is really hard to win a pvp fight with the PP if the opponent have another weapon, so the only way to get kills with it is to kill players with no shield or suprise them from behind. So how are you supposed to get the PP commendation 7/7 if you can't kill with it properly?

 

 

After all I think 343i have made a good job balancing the weapons compared to the previous halos.

 

I don't really agree with your assessment of the Boltshot: it IS very powerful, but requires perfect usage to get a kill: plus its regular shots are pretty much useless, so you HAVE to fire charged shots. And its range makes up for its power, as unless the user is willing to take a huge risk getting close to the target and taking the time to charge and fire, they won't be able to use it anyway.

 

As for the automatic weapons versus precision weapon arguments, I think they work great as is. Automatics are supposed to only work at close ranges, and lose beyond that, as if they worked at longer ranges they'd be incredibly difficult to fight against as they have so much ammunition and aim assist. It would be like having a mid-range shotgun.

 

And as far as the DMR goes, it's balanced fine, the problem is your play style. I'm amazed at the arguments against it: stop fighting it at its range! Get up close with an automatic weapon, or a Carbine or Battle Rifle: yes, you'll lose at long range, but you're supposed to lose at long range. It wouldn't be a very good long range weapon if it didn't reliably get kills at long range, would it? All you have to do is know what your own weapon's best range is (close range for automatics, mid-range for precisions) and you'll beat it every time.

 

The Plasma Pistol is just more like it used to be back in the older Halos, where it was basically a situational weapon. It's basically designed so that in Campaign there can be a lot of fire coming at you without actually killing you: in Multiplayer you're expected to use the overcharge to attack other players and vehicles. Plus, it's balanced against the Magnum, which is scoped for use at long range: seriously, while the Plasma Pistol takes forever to actually get a kill, have you seen how quickly it drops player shields? Fire off a few rounds and go for a melee, and you'll see just how effective it can be!

[Flippant Sol]

The perfect balance update would to make all long range weapons do 50% damage when zoomed out, but only in MM, this would demolish campaign and SO.

[Benchimus]

The perfect balance update would to make all long range weapons do 50% damage when zoomed out, but only in MM, this would demolish campaign and SO.

No. Just, no. The only thing that needs done at all is for the bloom to be fixed. While I love using the DMR, its bloom is nearly non-existant. Back in Reach ,I actually had to pace myself when firing across hemorrage, lest I miss that critical headshot and my prey get away. Now I dont bother pacing as the bloom seems to be visual only. Same with the magnum. Making the DMR's bloom grow out much larger and faster but with faster reset (much like the magnum in Reach) would fix the cross mapping woes and general dominance problems people seem to have.

[Rob T]

Check out this test on how the primary weapons are "balanced" against vehicles.

 

 

[Kiing 0f Coffe]

I don't really agree with your assessment of the Boltshot: it IS very powerful, but requires perfect usage to get a kill: plus its regular shots are pretty much useless, so you HAVE to fire charged shots. And its range makes up for its power, as unless the user is willing to take a huge risk getting close to the target and taking the time to charge and fire, they won't be able to use it anyway.

 

As for the automatic weapons versus precision weapon arguments, I think they work great as is. Automatics are supposed to only work at close ranges, and lose beyond that, as if they worked at longer ranges they'd be incredibly difficult to fight against as they have so much ammunition and aim assist. It would be like having a mid-range shotgun.

 

And as far as the DMR goes, it's balanced fine, the problem is your play style. I'm amazed at the arguments against it: stop fighting it at its range! Get up close with an automatic weapon, or a Carbine or Battle Rifle: yes, you'll lose at long range, but you're supposed to lose at long range. It wouldn't be a very good long range weapon if it didn't reliably get kills at long range, would it? All you have to do is know what your own weapon's best range is (close range for automatics, mid-range for precisions) and you'll beat it every time.

 

The Plasma Pistol is just more like it used to be back in the older Halos, where it was basically a situational weapon. It's basically designed so that in Campaign there can be a lot of fire coming at you without actually killing you: in Multiplayer you're expected to use the overcharge to attack other players and vehicles. Plus, it's balanced against the Magnum, which is scoped for use at long range: seriously, while the Plasma Pistol takes forever to actually get a kill, have you seen how quickly it drops player shields? Fire off a few rounds and go for a melee, and you'll see just how effective it can be!

I don't really agree with your assessment of the Boltshot: it IS very powerful, but requires perfect usage to get a kill: plus its regular shots are pretty much useless, so you HAVE to fire charged shots. And its range makes up for its power, as unless the user is willing to take a huge risk getting close to the target and taking the time to charge and fire, they won't be able to use it anyway.

 

As for the automatic weapons versus precision weapon arguments, I think they work great as is. Automatics are supposed to only work at close ranges, and lose beyond that, as if they worked at longer ranges they'd be incredibly difficult to fight against as they have so much ammunition and aim assist. It would be like having a mid-range shotgun.

 

And as far as the DMR goes, it's balanced fine, the problem is your play style. I'm amazed at the arguments against it: stop fighting it at its range! Get up close with an automatic weapon, or a Carbine or Battle Rifle: yes, you'll lose at long range, but you're supposed to lose at long range. It wouldn't be a very good long range weapon if it didn't reliably get kills at long range, would it? All you have to do is know what your own weapon's best range is (close range for automatics, mid-range for precisions) and you'll beat it every time.

 

The Plasma Pistol is just more like it used to be back in the older Halos, where it was basically a situational weapon. It's basically designed so that in Campaign there can be a lot of fire coming at you without actually killing you: in Multiplayer you're expected to use the overcharge to attack other players and vehicles. Plus, it's balanced against the Magnum, which is scoped for use at long range: seriously, while the Plasma Pistol takes forever to actually get a kill, have you seen how quickly it drops player shields? Fire off a few rounds and go for a melee, and you'll see just how effective it can be!

(Is there a way to fix this double quoting thing?) Ok! what you're saying about the boltshot is true and would be fine if it wasn't a secondary gun. The boltshot is very easy because we don't have these short bursts of sudden movement that elites do in the campaign. So, it is very easy to track a player with the boltshot until it is charged. I fully agree about the assault weapons they were done well. The DMR doesn't just own at long ranges ( which is what it was designed to do) but with decent aiming, the DMR wins vs. all of the other precision weapons except maybe the Carbine.

 

The plasma pistol is fine as it is but moving it to a 12 shot wouldn't hurt the game.

[RedStarRocket91]

(Is there a way to fix this double quoting thing?) Ok! what you're saying about the boltshot is true and would be fine if it wasn't a secondary gun. The boltshot is very easy because we don't have these short bursts of sudden movement that elites do in the campaign. So, it is very easy to track a player with the boltshot until it is charged. I fully agree about the assault weapons they were done well. The DMR doesn't just own at long ranges ( which is what it was designed to do) but with decent aiming, the DMR wins vs. all of the other precision weapons except maybe the Carbine.

 

The plasma pistol is fine as it is but moving it to a 12 shot wouldn't hurt the game.

 

Just press 'quote' once, it might take a few seconds to appear but it WILL come up eventually!

 

As for tracking a target with the Boltshot, there really are any number of things that could go wrong even before we consider timing and range. They could use a Hologram and the charged shot would be wasted firing on that, it could be absorbed by a Hardlight Shield, jumped over with Jet Pack or just dodged outright with Thruster Pack - and one miss is pretty much the end of the fight, considering the slow firing rate and the fact that they will be hitting you at point black range.

 

The DMR does lose to the Carbine at shorter ranges (it has a much longer kill time) and it doesn't have the versatility of the Lightrifle (which be both a short-range and long-range weapon), so I think it works as it is.

[Kiing 0f Coffe]

Just press 'quote' once, it might take a few seconds to appear but it WILL come up eventually!

 

As for tracking a target with the Boltshot, there really are any number of things that could go wrong even before we consider timing and range. They could use a Hologram and the charged shot would be wasted firing on that, it could be absorbed by a Hardlight Shield, jumped over with Jet Pack or just dodged outright with Thruster Pack - and one miss is pretty much the end of the fight, considering the slow firing rate and the fact that they will be hitting you at point black range.

 

The DMR does lose to the Carbine at shorter ranges (it has a much longer kill time) and it doesn't have the versatility of the Lightrifle (which be both a short-range and long-range weapon), so I think it works as it is.

Just press 'quote' once, it might take a few seconds to appear but it WILL come up eventually!

 

As for tracking a target with the Boltshot, there really are any number of things that could go wrong even before we consider timing and range. They could use a Hologram and the charged shot would be wasted firing on that, it could be absorbed by a Hardlight Shield, jumped over with Jet Pack or just dodged outright with Thruster Pack - and one miss is pretty much the end of the fight, considering the slow firing rate and the fact that they will be hitting you at point black range.

 

The DMR does lose to the Carbine at shorter ranges (it has a much longer kill time) and it doesn't have the versatility of the Lightrifle (which be both a short-range and long-range weapon), so I think it works as it is.

The lightrifle sucks at short range and the DMR is Much much MUCH better at shortrange, just like all of the other weapons. and the solutions of the boltshot rely on armour abilities and the hologram solution relies on people falling for the hologram. People shouldn't be limited to these armour abilities just because of the boltshot.

[RedStarRocket91]

The lightrifle sucks at short range and the DMR is Much much MUCH better at shortrange, just like all of the other weapons. and the solutions of the boltshot rely on armour abilities and the hologram solution relies on people falling for the hologram. People shouldn't be limited to these armour abilities just because of the boltshot.

 

I actually find the Lightrifle to be better at short range, so maybe I've just been lucky so far? Plus, those are just ways people can use the armour abilities they have to get around it - without armour abilities at all, there's the option of staying out of close-range altogether, jumping around (this is REALLY effective at close quarters where the turning speed is comparitively slow) or using grenades. Plus, it's such a high risk/reward weapon (if you miss the first shot, you're basically dead due to the slow firing rate and maximum of two shots per reload) and with such specific applications that it kind of deserves to get one-shot kills.

[Muh GBP]

I Think we need a way to find a role for the BR and the DMR, because the two weapons stand as fan favs in Halo 3 and Reach, and people should be able to pick there fav and now worry about which is best The DMR will ofcourse always win at long and the BR will win at close(If the nerf the DMR a little) but thats how the rifles are and I think most people can live with that. Im not sure about the carbine though... + The boltshot seems like its got more range than the scattershot shotgun(Sorry if thats not the right name, my game is in danish text...), the boltshot needs a little nerf in range but other than that it seems good, the fact that it does not have a scope is a suprisingly big minus

[Caboose The Ace]

i dont ise the dmr is use the br problem no i beat 2 guys who both had dmr and i had a br take that

[SegaGeneral]

The DMR is not OP people just been playing halo forever and know how to aim

[Muh GBP]

i dont ise the dmr is use the br problem no i beat 2 guys who both had dmr and i had a br take that

Im not saying its impossible to beat people with DMR´s, I have done it myself. All im saying is that if the two players are equel the DMR player tends to get the better of the BR player.

And I think I have to agree with the other people that maybe giving the DMR the bloom back (The real bloom) is the right way, because atleast then the gun takes more skill, like in reach

[Jerry]

I don't really agree with your assessment of the Boltshot: it IS very powerful, but requires perfect usage to get a kill: plus its regular shots are pretty much useless, so you HAVE to fire charged shots. And its range makes up for its power, as unless the user is willing to take a huge risk getting close to the target and taking the time to charge and fire, they won't be able to use it anyway.

 

As for the automatic weapons versus precision weapon arguments, I think they work great as is. Automatics are supposed to only work at close ranges, and lose beyond that, as if they worked at longer ranges they'd be incredibly difficult to fight against as they have so much ammunition and aim assist. It would be like having a mid-range shotgun.

 

And as far as the DMR goes, it's balanced fine, the problem is your play style. I'm amazed at the arguments against it: stop fighting it at its range! Get up close with an automatic weapon, or a Carbine or Battle Rifle: yes, you'll lose at long range, but you're supposed to lose at long range. It wouldn't be a very good long range weapon if it didn't reliably get kills at long range, would it? All you have to do is know what your own weapon's best range is (close range for automatics, mid-range for precisions) and you'll beat it every time.

 

The Plasma Pistol is just more like it used to be back in the older Halos, where it was basically a situational weapon. It's basically designed so that in Campaign there can be a lot of fire coming at you without actually killing you: in Multiplayer you're expected to use the overcharge to attack other players and vehicles. Plus, it's balanced against the Magnum, which is scoped for use at long range: seriously, while the Plasma Pistol takes forever to actually get a kill, have you seen how quickly it drops player shields? Fire off a few rounds and go for a melee, and you'll see just how effective it can be!

After reading trough your comments, and other forums with similar topics. I have found out that many other players doesn't either like the DMR and boltshot as they are now. But after reading RedStarRocket91;s comment some things made me change my mind. You were right about the automatic weapons, i thought of what you said when i was playing, and they are all very powerful, thouhg you must be very close with the suppressor since the spred is big but once you are close it kills very fast.

The bolshot would be useless without the shotgunshot just as you said, and I agreed what you said that the shotgunshot is good until I played some games against many players who used it very much. I can not say they were very skilled, but still they managed to easily get kills when I had the sword, so i came up with an idea, that would make the boltshot a bit harder to use but still powerful, how about if it would charge like a spartanlaser, that you dont have that extra second to choose when to fire when you have charged it, it would only fire when you have charge to the max. What would you think about that?

I am sorry for my previous comment I have calculated wrong with the PP it doesnt kill with 13 shots, it kills with 12 shgots and it overheats if you press rapidly the trigger with 12 shots. Since i posted my latest comment here, I have played alot with the plasma pistol and actually got almost a hundred kills with it. So it takes a bit skill to get kills with it but its not impossible.

But then again the DMR, i can not say I agree on everything you said about it but still i think you are right. In my opinion it kinda spoils the fun of the big maps, for example, ragnarok. But then again I guess its just my own personal feelings to that weapon that are bad...