Wow there really is no tactical gameplay here!

[Balloonloons]

Figured I would revisit 4 after playing reach for the last two weeks. So I played 3 games and got annoyed at each and every one. Each of them was spent fighting campers. No one moves around anymore. There is no tactical advantage in holding down a part of a map and no point in doing so anymore. Remember the good old days when people were forced to move around in search for weapons and things like that? No you spawn instantly with the weapons you want and then get others delivered in front of you. In the games I played it was all about hunkering down in one spot and staying there till you die and then you and your team spawns in another spot and you hold that spot down. No point in doing anything else. It's so stupid and boring! I don't see how anyone can be entertained by this gameplay style for more than 30 minutes.

 

After playing reach for two weeks and coming back to this the difference is night and day in how you actually progress through a round. Reach is exciting and thrilling. If you're good you can take out a team of 4 on your own like Bruce lee. In 4 if you're good it doesn't matter. The guy you just fought will respawn instantly anyway and take you out or you will be up against a team of 6 campers from long distance. Think it's safe to say the thrill is gone. Staying alive no longer seems like a goal since life is meaningless. I can respawn and get to where I died about instantly. This adds to the feeling of just wandering around aimlessly like a chicken without a head. It's more exciting to charge someone with a sticky than stay across map shooting around for 15 minutes.

 

Only way you can say 4 is better than reach is if you live to camp in place and avoid man to man combat. Shotgun is useless. Sword even more so. Guys complaining about boltshot? Give me a break! I can rape a bolt shot from a mile away with my dmr. You're just mad close up combat occurred for 10 seconds in this miserable game because you're a noob camper who loves the cross map shooting and nothing more. Keep cloaking and enjoy 4 in that case. You're not good. You're a little girl.

[LiQuid BioniX]

I also don't know how you can base this rant off of playing three games. You get bad games. It happens in every other video game on the planet. If I judged Halo 3 by the first three games I played, I would have put it down forever.

[iHaNGMaNi]

I will say I sort of agree. I have played many games where I will four shot the guy, he gets the fifth shot in. I respawn, turn one corner, and finish him off. The timer for deaths needs to be put back in very badly.

 

I will also agree though that you have gotten some bad games. Adrift is a big problem with camping a spot as a team (the hallways), but other maps aren't as bad.

 

When I think of there being a lack of tactical gameplay, I think of the majority of the community in this game. Granted, it was the same as H3 (never played Reach), but it's still frustrating. I was laid off and there are some days where I am on for most of the day when there's nothing else to do, and I have few to no friends online. The randoms I run into seem to have started their Halo journey with 4, and are horrible. Maybe it's my imagination, but the amount of people who run into firefights outgunned and manned, the people who rely in invisibility to get there 3-20 k/d, or the basic stupidity of some people, makes me really just want to add each and every good player I run across.

 

Let's not even get started on the lack of tactics because most people seem to have lost their mics, or voices, or intelligence.

[TRF BaDInTentZs]

it's not needed after Halo turned into COD

[Balloonloons]

I also don't know how you can base this rant off of playing three games. You get bad games. It happens in every other video game on the planet. If I judged Halo 3 by the first three games I played, I would have put it down forever.

 

Read it again. What I said was I decided to give it another chance. Meaning I played way more than 3 games of halo 4. Most of my time spent on it was week 1 when I still had high hopes for it. Soon after I realized it was not halo anymore as my frustration with matchmaking grew. I stopped playing it. Then I picked it up again yesterday to give it a chance. I was quickly reminded of why I put it down as nothing had changed. That's my point.

[ProudDrunkIrish]

I agree almost entirely, never did play a lot of reach but an insane amount of Halo 3, in that game if you were good you could take on and defeat 2 enemies in this game that does not happen, too many perks, too many easy to use weapons, too easy to get weapons.

 

Take valhalla for example i have been on teams where not a single other player has tried to advance even as far as the centre hill, they run off to the sides sit there and wait, as a result any enemy that comes over the hill has a team firing at him so the enemy never advance beyond the hill.

 

As a fun game this is less fun than CoD at the moment and I say that with much regret, Halo 3 ate a large chunk of my life while H4 is something I get bored of in a few rounds. I am not the only one as my friends who loved H3 and reach are currently playing a mixture of other games (not 1 of em on halo) which shows its failure.

 

The assault for the power weapons and everyone starting on a fair playing field made previous halo's into an all out assault team warfare game where the best player won and deserved to win. Halo 4 is a noob friendly shadow of it.

[Forlorn Penguin]

Halo never really was tactical. You could could argue that it used to be more tactical than it is now, but if that's true, it wasn't by much.

 

As for attributing the lack of pick-up weapons as a major offender to this, I wouldn't say that a team winning because they had power weapons and the other team didn't is "tactical". I'd call that unbalanced.

[ProudDrunkIrish]

As for attributing the lack of pick-up weapons as a major offender to this, I wouldn't say that a team winning because they had power weapons and the other team didn't is "tactical". I'd call that unbalanced.

 

To be honest it is the reason, the best players won the fight for the power weapons and then they controlled a lvlv for a bit thanks to their good work, the fact that you had to move during a round to see if these weapons had returned stopped this new sort of camping, Also a team playing together (talking to each other) knew what weapons and even how many shots in said weapons the enemy had.

 

The people who complain about the old system are usually those who were not as good and wanted an easier game, Halo should be hard - it means you have to improve. I was rubbish online at the start of Halo 3 but by the end I was confident of beating anyone.. (didn't always happen but hey if they won they were better), there is no becoming great at this game its just too easy, I played no reach and thus no halo game at all from just after reach came out (went off playing CoD), I came back to play H4 and i find there is little difference between me and the lads who played reach a lot. This is the sign of a noob game people are complaining about. In previous games teamates used their heads but now it appears an epidemic of brain rot has hit the gaming community

[Forlorn Penguin]

To be honest it is the reason, the best players won the fight for the power weapons and then they controlled a lvlv for a bit thanks to their good work, the fact that you had to move during a round to see if these weapons had returned stopped this new sort of camping, Also a team playing together (talking to each other) knew what weapons and even how many shots in said weapons the enemy had.

 

I can agree that the "better team" would take out the other and secure the power weapons, but after that, it's not about skill, it's about getting free kills with with power weapons. Besides, if the team that won the initial firefight is better, why do they need the free tickets? That's like playing Mario Kart and having the player in 1st place get a Power Star. He's already in the lead, he doesn't need that.

 

I'm not saying that the losing team should get the free tickets, but it wasn't exactly a good system before. They need to come up with a real way to make the game actually play tactically.

[ProudDrunkIrish]

Power weapons were relativley few and had limited ammo, also there were more than any 1 team could get, take the pit, each team got their sniper, shotgun, plasma pistol, BR's, and brute shot (could include mauler), they then had to fight for the sword, invis, overshield and rockets. It was rare 1 team got them all and so this free kill advantage you speak of went both ways.

 

The fixed weapon spaans created a good battle from start to finish, they kept the round fluid, hell a decent player with a plasma pistol and a BR could take out the rocket launcher carrier.

 

The game was about skill and hanging back meant garunteed death. Gone are those good days..

 

Now the worst player in the round who steals a few kills can end up with the best weapon in the game, drops are random and unpredictable, hell i have been on sprees and got a needler/grenades/speed boost drop (none of which suit say ragnarok, and some player playing rubbish will get a spartan or sniper

 

Now what is fair in that and who is getting cheap kills??????????

[TornadoFlame]

I can agree that the "better team" would take out the other and secure the power weapons, but after that, it's not about skill, it's about getting free kills with with power weapons. Besides, if the team that won the initial firefight is better, why do they need the free tickets? That's like playing Mario Kart and having the player in 1st place get a Power Star. He's already in the lead, he doesn't need that.

 

I'm not saying that the losing team should get the free tickets, but it wasn't exactly a good system before. They need to come up with a real way to make the game actually play tactically.

 

your joking right? so basicaly if your team is losing you want rockets to spawn right in front of you. No your bad your gonna lose so get better don't say the game didn't take skill cause of power weapons in MLG my team lost rockets sniper Oversheild countless times on pit and still found a way to win because we were more skilled and the better team. this is what i mean you sound like you want good people punished for being good so lets make this watered down cod version. *no offense towards you i don't know your halo skill but I have No idea how you can say the people who got power weapons always won cause of free kills. Herp Derp of your losing? heres a inceration cannon and binary rifle Wtf kinda crap is that?

[Forlorn Penguin]

Now the worst player in the round who steals a few kills can end up with the best weapon in the game, drops are random and unpredictable, hell i have been on sprees and got a needler/grenades/speed boost drop (none of which suit say ragnarok, and some player playing rubbish will get a spartan or sniper

 

Now what is fair in that and who is getting cheap kills??????????

 

Yeah, I agree that the ordnance drops are pretty screwed up. I rarely get anything I want with mine. Meanwhile, my enemies are getting rockets and Binary Rifles.

 

so basicaly if your team is losing you want rockets to spawn right in front of you.

 

I didn't say that, as you can see here:

 

I'm not saying that the losing team should get the free tickets, but it wasn't exactly a good system before.

 

My point is that I agree that the game is not tactical now, but it never actually was to begin with and bringing back weapon pick-ups won't change that. They need to do something that encourages actual tactical gameplay. What, I don't know, but Halo's core gameplay style as it has been for the past 11 years doesn't really allow for tactical gameplay.

[Balloonloons]

 

 

Yeah, I agree that the ordnance drops are pretty screwed up. I rarely get anything I want with mine. Meanwhile, my enemies are getting rockets and Binary Rifles.

 

 

 

I didn't say that, as you can see here:

 

 

 

My point is that I agree that the game is not tactical now, but it never actually was to begin with and bringing back weapon pick-ups won't change that. They need to do something that encourages actual tactical gameplay. What, I don't know, but Halo's core gameplay style as it has been for the past 11 years doesn't really allow for tactical gameplay.

youre arguing without any point basically. You're saying to make the game more tactical than it was before? What do you want? To collect minerals and call it Starcraft? The tactical part of halo was to control weapon spawns and you did that by teamwork. If teamwork failed then you lose the weapons. If you are bad this means you lose. But lets be honest. There are plenty of times the opposing team had all the weapons and you were still able to beat them. Think capture the flag which isn't even about getting kills. You could still capture a flag! Now ctf has turned into a camping for kills match instead. It's so lame. Why even leave the base if you're getting blasted across the map by campers?

 

Also worth mentioning is that there was even tactic involved in killing people. For example throw a nade because I know you're coming around the corner than blast you to death. Your fault for not paying attention. Now we have the noob friendly nade icon which alerts you that I planted a grenade there for you to walk into. How lame is that!?

 

Close combat also involved maneuvering. Now close combat is non existent. Any noob can sit across the map and shoot a gun that is just as accurate and damaging from far as it is close. Back in the day if you had rockets and blasted someone across the map you were like oooooooooohhh yeaaaaaaa. Now all you need is a finger to spam bullets across the map with results that far exceed a power weapon like rockets. That doesn't make for good gameplay! It's boring as hell!

[Real Talk]

I think the biggest issue is the big maps. Big maps are fun and all but as you said balloons (although quite exagerrated) they can easily be turned into a camp fest. (Personally I give the credit for that to the DMR).

The DMR + No weapon spawn + Big Map = Encouraging camping.

 

343 needs to bring in some close range maps, I want Guardian brought into Halo 4 or at least a map or two around its size. Sorry to say 343 but big maps are not exactly your thing (Vortex anybody?).

[Chris Hansen]

You're arguement about the bolt shot is invalid. It's a great camping weapon, they get close, bolt shot, run around a corner, enemy follows, bolt shot.

 

Cqc doesn't happen with a bolt shot lol. One shot and the fight is over.

[OMG Treason]

I think the biggest issue is the big maps. Big maps are fun and all but as you said balloons (although quite exagerrated) they can easily be turned into a camp fest. (Personally I give the credit for that to the DMR).

The DMR + No weapon spawn + Big Map = Encouraging camping.

 

343 needs to bring in some close range maps, I want Guardian brought into Halo 4 or at least a map or two around its size. Sorry to say 343 but big maps are not exactly your thing (Vortex anybody?).

I agree Vortex is the worst thing ever..

[Balloonloons]

I think the biggest issue is the big maps. Big maps are fun and all but as you said balloons (although quite exagerrated) they can easily be turned into a camp fest. (Personally I give the credit for that to the DMR).

The DMR + No weapon spawn + Big Map = Encouraging camping.

 

343 needs to bring in some close range maps, I want Guardian brought into Halo 4 or at least a map or two around its size. Sorry to say 343 but big maps are not exactly your thing (Vortex anybody?).

i wish it was exaggerated but so far it's been my only experience with this game literally! That's why I'm so annoyed at it!

 

Also with infinite running ability small maps would be horrible in this. So they have to remove that for small maps. Imagine a small map with everyone jogging around? Lol. Nightmare!

[Real Talk]

i wish it was exaggerated but so far it's been my only experience with this game literally! That's why I'm so annoyed at it!

 

Also with infinite running ability small maps would be horrible in this. So they have to remove that for small maps. Imagine a small map with everyone jogging around? Lol. Nightmare!

 

If they had sprinting on Guardian that would be something ! Gameplay could be so fast it would make your head spin haha. Sprinting would be quite limited though with the tight corriders on small maps.

 

And they could always disable sprinting on small maps if they ever made a map that small (which I doubt).

[LiQuid BioniX]

I agree Vortex is the worst thing ever..

 

Yep. I never, ever have fun on that map. It's the only map that I've really realized is a camp fest.

[Halogeek99]

I think the biggest issue is the big maps. Big maps are fun and all but as you said balloons (although quite exagerrated) they can easily be turned into a camp fest. (Personally I give the credit for that to the DMR).

The DMR + No weapon spawn + Big Map = Encouraging camping.

 

343 needs to bring in some close range maps, I want Guardian brought into Halo 4 or at least a map or two around its size. Sorry to say 343 but big maps are not exactly your thing (Vortex anybody?).

 

Or force weapon loadouts and have plasmas, boltshot and carbines (Dmr, Br, Lr, carbine) in the drops. This also removes some of the bigger power weapons from drops/gameplay, making them a rearer occurrence. Better. No wait. ******* Great!! Quick fix for ALL. Employ me 353.

 

Forgot to say. Op: I love you!

[Josh X574]

Big maps DO provoke camping, imho. However, sometimes we have to conclude that the players camp, not because of weapon availability or effectiveness, but because thats the kind of players that play halo now. I agree that halo 4 isnt tactical, however, ive rarely seen any halo game being tactical unless you have a clan or party of friends. Most games ive ever played are not camp fests, but campers DO exist. When the camping community is tired of halo 4, they will leave, leaving the traditional community to halo.

[SkItZo1041]

Sword is useless? Well that doesn't make much sense... With promethean vision and speed boost in the game, I think it's more useful than ever before. And that's saying something. What gametype do you play that is so horrific? Team Regicide, regular Infinity Slayer, and Dominion usually aren't bad with campers. BTB, objective, and Swat usually are though. Ragnarok is the worst camper-wise in general, that's why I no longer play games that have more than 5 people on each team, except Dominion even though camping is horrible there, it can still be fun. It really sucks, because on Reach my gametypes were Swat, BTB, Invasion, and then Infection. Now, I limit myself to Infinity Slayer, Team Regicide, and sometimes Dominion, simply because that limits my rage quitting to the minimum it can be for this game. It just seems like the small maps are too big, and the big maps are too small in this game. Besides abandon, that's tiny, but it's awful.

[Balloonloons]

Sword is useless? Well that doesn't make much sense... With promethean vision and speed boost in the game, I think it's more useful than ever before. And that's saying something. What gametype do you play that is so horrific? Team Regicide, regular Infinity Slayer, and Dominion usually aren't bad with campers. BTB, objective, and Swat usually are though. Ragnarok is the worst camper-wise in general, that's why I no longer play games that have more than 5 people on each team, except Dominion even though camping is horrible there, it can still be fun. It really sucks, because on Reach my gametypes were Swat, BTB, Invasion, and then Infection. Now, I limit myself to Infinity Slayer, Team Regicide, and sometimes Dominion, simply because that limits my rage quitting to the minimum it can be for this game. It just seems like the small maps are too big, and the big maps are too small in this game. Besides abandon, that's tiny, but it's awful.

. Yes sword is useless and no longer a must have weapon. Only way to get kills with it? Everyone say it all together now.....camp!!! Lol. Crouch in place for an entire game and hope someone comes by. And then you better make sure they are close because since you both have unlimited sprint chances are you will get blasted by his team by the time you even reach his face. Or if the guy is any good he will just rape you with the super powered dmr anyway by the time you even swing. Or chances are they probably have a bolt shot they spawned with anyway. So again sword useless. Yes.

 

I play all the lists and all of them make me want to tear my eyeballs out with toothpicks.

[Tekknoman]

I can't explain how well you put my thoughts on H4 into perspective with this post. I wasn't a real Halo fan until my friends got me into competitive H3 gaming. I can't tell you how well thought out and well built H3 was. It was a perfect combination of respawns, skill, weapon placement... the list goes on.

 

As for all the stuff that sucks about H4 right now, I'm hoping with faith and a little patience 343 will adjust the game mechanics. The power weapons on drops is stupid.. take those out and instead replace it with ammo, perks, nades. Place the power weapons soley on the map and go from there. That would address alot of the frustration of "tactical" camping. Kill the instant respawn. So sad.. whats the point of being a better player if you can't use the advantage to it's fullest?

[Balloonloons]

Big maps DO provoke camping, imho. However, sometimes we have to conclude that the players camp, not because of weapon availability or effectiveness, but because thats the kind of players that play halo now. I agree that halo 4 isnt tactical, however, ive rarely seen any halo game being tactical unless you have a clan or party of friends. Most games ive ever played are not camp fests, but campers DO exist. When the camping community is tired of halo 4, they will leave, leaving the traditional community to halo.

. That is ridiculous lol. Not even going to touch this one really. I'll just say this. If you have to push a gas pedal to drive a car, you push the gas pedal. If the only way to survive or get kills in halo is to camp then you camp. You're forced into it.