For all the guys who want Halo to be Old School

[Tesseract]

Just gives me some clarification here... What exactly do you wish stayed the same from previous Halo games? Those games had flaws, just as this one did. Halo 3 was perfect in my book, but you can't expect a series to stay the same forever. See, unlike CoD, this isn't a game you can just shovel to the masses every year. Bungie and 343 take a decent amount of time and effort into these games. And for a developer, you always want to see your game evolve in different ways. If a new game had to remain exactly the same as the last, there'd be no real purpose for it in the first place! Oh, better graphics? No. To continue a story? Maybe. Only if you were under a very near deadline, it could be forgivable. I had fun breaking out of maps too, but in the eyes of a developer, it's just something you don't want to see.

 

But I'd hate to break this to you people: it's never going back to the way it was. Ever. Everything needs a change. You can choose to follow it or move on to something else. Especially because it's under a new company, which is not entirely composed of Bungie members, as usually mistaken.

 

I mean, there are many flaws with Halo 4, such as earning all these pointless medals, sniping, large map, infinite sprint (which isn't exactly infinite, btw.), etc... But there's many workarounds to this. You want a map like Guardian? Okay, we'll disable loadouts with Mobility so that people aren't sprinting constantly. Don't forget that settings can be tweaked for certain gametypes!

 

Halo 4 is an improvement from Reach in my eyes, but there are many disappointments that came with it. No working File Sharing and file searching, latency issues and player search in matchmaking, no plasma launcher, and how they ruined Infection and crappy Custom settings.. But you know, it's not over. It's only been out for a month. There's PLENTY of time for improvement. To me, it seems like they rushed it a little bit because they didn't want us to wait anymore. I certainly would not mind waiting longer for a higher quality product. Just don't give up on this game yet!

[OMG Treason]

Couldn't of said or better my friend nice post.

[Twisted Oracle]

Infection is the only thing in my mind that needs to come back so we can make epic custom games like fat kid again

[Caboose The Ace]

halo 4 pretty much flawless best halo yet

[Rogue10000]

|It doesnt matter what reasons you come up with for why a game has to change or why it isnt like the previous games but it all comes down to one thing-

 

Will people play the game, will it be seen as a classic like some of the previous games?

 

For me, im struggleing to keep playing, i just dont enjoy the game, i played Halo one for over 5 years because it had 5+ awesome maps, Gulch, sidewinder, hangemhigh, ice fields, danger canyon, infinity, Halo 4 hasnt got ONE map that is HALF as good as any of those.

 

also, CTF is my gametype, its all i play, and by this point it has been so watered down for the noobs its rediculous, if the team gets the flag past half way you might as well let them cap for the only reason they can die and respawn and keep edging the flag untill they cap, and past half the map they have less travel time than you. This wouldnt be a problem if i could play custom settings via a custom lobby, but they didnt think to include that in the game, im stuck with matchmaking and default map settings.

 

In halo 1 very good players would miss with the sniper rifle from time to time, in this they made it so easy- average players seem to never miss.

 

They can make it like COD or any other game for all i care, as long as the game is fun to play.

 

But like i said, when all is said and done i probably wont play this for more than another few weeks while i played Halo one for well over 5 years.

[littletunny]

To the OP, you are defending the indefensible.

 

Halo 4 is not Halo, its Call of Duty.

 

You think all the sudden H4 is going to get better?

 

This is as good as good as it gets. The game is a beta. The maps suck. The game is jerky an laggy like hell. There is no rank system so you dont know if you are improving or not. 343 will release more sucky maps and make YOU pay for them cause they were too cheap to include them in the original release and the wanted to beat COD black ops to the punch.

 

DULL BORING YAWN!!!!!!!!

[Cortar]

Just gives me some clarification here... What exactly do you wish stayed the same from previous Halo games? Those games had flaws, just as this one did. Halo 3 was perfect in my book, but you can't expect a series to stay the same forever. See, unlike CoD, this isn't a game you can just shovel to the masses every year. Bungie and 343 take a decent amount of time and effort into these games. And for a developer, you always want to see your game evolve in different ways. If a new game had to remain exactly the same as the last, there'd be no real purpose for it in the first place! Oh, better graphics? No. To continue a story? Maybe. Only if you were under a very near deadline, it could be forgivable. I had fun breaking out of maps too, but in the eyes of a developer, it's just something you don't want to see.

 

But I'd hate to break this to you people: it's never going back to the way it was. Ever. Everything needs a change. You can choose to follow it or move on to something else. Especially because it's under a new company, which is not entirely composed of Bungie members, as usually mistaken.

 

I mean, there are many flaws with Halo 4, such as earning all these pointless medals, sniping, large map, infinite sprint (which isn't exactly infinite, btw.), etc... But there's many workarounds to this. You want a map like Guardian? Okay, we'll disable loadouts with Mobility so that people aren't sprinting constantly. Don't forget that settings can be tweaked for certain gametypes!

 

Halo 4 is an improvement from Reach in my eyes, but there are many disappointments that came with it. No working File Sharing and file searching, latency issues and player search in matchmaking, no plasma launcher, and how they ruined Infection and crappy Custom settings.. But you know, it's not over. It's only been out for a month. There's PLENTY of time for improvement. To me, it seems like they rushed it a little bit because they didn't want us to wait anymore. I certainly would not mind waiting longer for a higher quality product. Just don't give up on this game yet!

 

 

The problem with this argument which fanboiz keep regurgitating endlessly is that Halos 1, 2 and 3 were all different, yet kept the same core gameplay. Their sales were fine, the community was happy. There was no reason to mess up the core gameplay of Halo (weapons on map, no loadouts or perks, etc). You can add new stuff, like Halos 2 and 3 did, but they kept the core gameplay. Dont throw the baby out with the bathwater! Imagine if the next call of duty game had shields and no perks, people would be rightly angry!

 

Halo has always been one of the more "pure" FPSs, that is, there was no advantage given to higher "level" players; each game was an even playing field at the very start, everyone had the same abilities and weapons. But they threw that out of the window in Halo 4.... for no reason. Halo has entered the modern era and assimilated into the COD, Battlefield, etc style of play.

 

Also, the another problem of Halo 4 that you mentioned by breezed over is the lack of customization of custom games. If Halo 4 is supposed to be the new and 'evolved' game, then why are there LESS options for game makers? If Halo 4 is so evolved why then is there no ranking on release, unlike Halo 2 and 3? Why are there maps on disk that you have to pay to unlock? Why did they delete some of the BEST gametypes (1 flag ctf and race?)? Why are there less matchmaking hoppers????

 

 

 

*Note I don't consider Reach to be any but a pile of **** so I never include it when talking about Halo

[SatanicBagels]

To the OP, you are defending the indefensible.

 

Halo 4 is not Halo, its Call of Duty.

 

You think all the sudden H4 is going to get better?

 

This is as good as good as it gets. The game is a beta. The maps suck. The game is jerky an laggy like hell. There is no rank system so you dont know if you are improving or not. 343 will release more sucky maps and make YOU pay for them cause they were too cheap to include them in the original release and the wanted to beat COD black ops to the punch.

 

DULL BORING YAWN!!!!!!!!

 

You're still lurking around the site with your stupidity...

 

World class troll is world class...

[Tesseract]

To the OP, you are defending the indefensible.

 

Halo 4 is not Halo, its Call of Duty.

 

You think all the sudden H4 is going to get better?

 

This is as good as good as it gets. The game is a beta. The maps suck. The game is jerky an laggy like hell. There is no rank system so you dont know if you are improving or not. 343 will release more sucky maps and make YOU pay for them cause they were too cheap to include them in the original release and the wanted to beat COD black ops to the punch.

 

DULL BORING YAWN!!!!!!!!

 

The game doesn't play anything like CoD. I'm tired of that false comparison. Anyone who's played both games would know it's still pretty different. And yeah, it can get better. Reach got better near the end with their title update. The developers have the power to change elements we don't, so you don't know what could happen.

[Bloody Initiate]

I didn't want things to stay the same, but I wanted the things that worked well to remain mostly unchanged and the things that didn't to be improved.

 

I also really like a lot of the new stuff. I like the perks (Notice how no one calls them anything else, and Halo 4 doesn't call them "perks?" It's significant), and I defended all the AAs in Reach, even Armor Lock (Still laugh at people who couldn't handle it).

 

They've been nerfing a lot of stuff though, really since Halo: CE. The pistol was way too good for sure, but no one minded really because back then people just didn't take games as seriously (See: Halo: CE Legendary ending).

 

Nerfing is really the problem. They've continually knocked down the best-performing aspects of the game because they - like many game developers - never figure out that nerfing doesn't really work. Slowly but surely the player's ability to affect what is happening on screen decreases.

 

In very rare cases, Nerfing is necessary, but in 99% of the cases, it's the wrong - but easy - thing to do.

 

If you have 10 guns, and 1 is better than all of them, then most developers nerf that one. It's easy, and it seems like the right thing to do. The problem is that in the time it took you to figure out how your own game worked, the players figured it out on day 1 and have been enjoying it since. They're fast like that, the players, and they enjoy things that work, especially when those things let them feel confident and capable in the game.

 

Then you take away that thing they enjoy, and instead of 1 good gun and 9 bad ones they now have 10 equally uninteresting and ineffective weapons. You needed to look at what worked about the 1, and you needed to bring that home. Then you'd have 10 fun things instead of none.

 

All the players see is that they had something good, and you took it away. This is the biggest reason nerfing doesn't work, because even when it DOES work mechanically it doesn't work politically. People HATE having things taken away from them after they've tasted them.

 

They've been doing this with all the things that worked well. All of them. I just used guns as the simple example. You know what else doesn't work as well as it used to? The Warthog, the Banshee, the player's movement speed, the Jet Pack, Active Camo, any and all of the player's starting weapons, The Scorpion, the HUD, the weapon recovery after using certain armor abiltiies, the list goes on.

 

They keep knocking down stuff that works and throwing us a bunch of shiny things hoping we won't notice or care. The MECHANICAL aspects of the gameplay have gotten less and less consequential while we gain the capacity to customize our armor, accumulate funds, and shop for new weapons (which are weaker than ever before) and abilities (Which are designed specifically to have a low impact on gameplay individually).

 

I actually really like almost ALL of the new stuff as far is it looks and feels, but as for how it all WORKS? I don't like weaker weapons, especially ones that performed differently once upon a time and WERE FINE IN THOSE GAMES. It's that old "don't fix what isn't broken" adage coming out again.

 

There are exceptions of course, the sniper rifle has mostly just gotten better and better (although I think the Reach sniper rifle was better, just for a lack of contenders), and I'm actually glad they weakened grenades instead of keeping them strong as they were in Halo: Reach. The Reach grenades were insane and almost completely unavoidable.

 

I like a lot about this game, and in fact the complaints I outline above aren't deal breakers so far. I just use the King DMR and need to work on my teamwork, then I'll be set. It just bothers me how many things that don't work remain the same and how the things that DO work get changed. I'll never forgive the BR being 5 shot, and I'll never forgive the fact that I had to "(L) to crawl" at the end of the campaign. They copied some of the worst aspects of Call of Duty, a series of games I respect and enjoy, but don't regard as perfect.

 

If they'd just get it out of their heads that they need to knock down the best performing mechanics, and instead they need to look at those as examples of how things SHOULD work... They'd have to do a little more work (elevating 9 aspects is harder than nerfing 1) but they'd be on the road to becoming absolutely singular and a cut above other developers. They struck gold with certain aspects of Halo in the past, but dismissed it as dirt.

 

The game doesn't play anything like CoD. I'm tired of that false comparison. Anyone who's played both games would know it's still pretty different.

 

It takes longer to kill people in this game, which I admit is a very big difference, but aside from spending a second or two more on a fight (I think they tend to be over in under a second in CoD), it plays a LOT like Call of Duty. Usually outside of actual fighting though. Fights in Call of Duty and other military-style shooters tend to be less like fights and more like paper-rock-scissors. If you saw someone first and had the right weapon and situation, you get a kill. "Skill" in those games has almost all its influence before the trigger is pulled. There was no "fight" just a series of kills. That's probably the biggest difference. You actually have individual combat in Halo.

 

The maps are designed with fewer and fewer dead ends and lots of ways into each location, this creates a circular flow where you always have someone behind you.

 

You respawn instantly and can move very fast OUTSIDE combat but move very slow in combat. The result is you get back to the fight quicker and that fight is determined less by skil and more by circumstance.

 

You have fewer indicators on your HUD that tell you what is going on with your team. Without a mic, they're just a bunch of people who probably aren't going to shoot you.

 

There are killcams, which I hate. The only thing more frustrating than suspecting the person who killed me wasn't very good is seeing it proven with footage from their perspective. Oh how exciting, he was spamming grenades into the hill. Oh how intense, he walked up on me when I was one-shot and mopped up the kill. Oh how fascinating, he was actually aiming at my ally but I was just in the wrong place at the wrong time and caught the stray snipe. I REALLY HATE killcams, and what I hate most about them is that they were very Call of Duty. I enjoyed what I played of the Call of Duty games, but that was like their trademark. To see the people responsible for Halo rip off something so specific is just painfully disappointing.

 

I'm gonna stop typing now because this a monster of a post. Sorry for the long read. I actually have been enjoying Halo 4, but I'm really afraid of what's going to happen with the novelty of "new" wears off. I was confused and upset when I found I just couldn't play Reach without screaming about nuclear grenades or no bleedthrough. I want to have fun, and I'm not that picky. I just hate nerfing, and I hate when something that works well is seen as a problem instead of an example.

[DoctorB77]

The one thing I was hoping for from 343 were these improvements. But even more than I wanted the improvements I wanted the ability to turn them off. I expected to see more options that could be edited and turned on and off that would male the game feel like it did before in the custom games. I also am baffled that after all of this worry about 343 changing the game that they did not include a classic playlist with the older settings. Hopefully 343 is really paying attention to the community and will fix some of the issues soon.

[Tesseract]

I don't know about the CoD thing. You've got different physics, huge maps that aren't as complicated as CoD maps, no killstreaks that bombard the other team... But I see what you are saying. The warthog isn't fun to drive anymore. The turret is terrible and the crosshair! It's so faded, it's invisible sometimes.

[Final Sentence]

Halo CE player since day one...

It was basic and to the point, out slay the other team, control the map and you win.

 

Maps were basic, and open (none of this getting stuck on corners or having to jump shot around everything)

 

Weapons, again basic and to the point

1. AR Short range good for double melees

2. Pistol, all around good weapon, can lock the game down

3. Sniper, had to lead targets at range, not easiest to use

4. Shotgun, worked like it should close to mid range

5. Plasma Pistol (slowed and took down OS)

7. Plasma Rifle (slowed and great close quarter)

8. Rockets, couldn't pull from secondary to snap spin as they'd cause "side ways rockets" shouldn't be able to jump and blindly fire a rocket to save yourself.

9. Needler, but really it's the needler, the fun kill

 

Timing of Power-ups and Spawns

1. Created map control points

2. Caused team work

3. No randomness to the game, it was going to be there PERIOD

 

Objectives

1. No Flag Marker

2. Looking at the ground with flag was the way to run without being seen

3. Wasn't forced to keep the flag, could drop it and fire

4. Wasn't forced to keep the oddball either, instant pickup made for good close quarter combat

 

Vehicles

They all played perfectly fine and didn't need anymore than the basic three

1. Warthog

2. Tank

3. Ghost

 

Basic Gameplay

1. Back-Pack Reloading (easy, everyone could do it)

2. Double Melee (again, easy, everyone can do it)

3. Fall Damage (should have never left the game, jump off something isn't a get away strat)

4. Grenade jumping / rocket jumps

5. INF ammo (only done easily in campaign)

6. Moving weapons around the map with grenades, helped regain map control if you lost it

7. Fast paced games that kept you coming back for me, and some LONG objective games that made you not want to quit

8. Driving with the flag, Not a bad thing with such fast kill times.

9. SuperJumping with the gunner from the warthog (helped move around some maps)

10. Radar was turned OFF!!!!! on the majority of the preferred gametype FOR A REASON!!! <--this right here might be the biggest reason I miss playing Halo: CE. I am beyond sick of pre-nades and corner campers because of radar. It's a faced paced FPS, MOVE AROUND THE MAP STOP SITTING STILL!!!

[Cocoa]

I enjoy the changes. Its a game for fun, not the world series of baseball. This is the fifth game it was time for some radical changes, Halo- Hali Reach was getting stale.

 

Lastly

Map control=camping

Weapon control=power weapon camping.

I should nof have to play with a timer for weapon drops or go into forge and memorize all the spawn points to have a chance in the game.

[Cpt Picardo]

Halo CE <-- Seriusly? It might have been a good game 15 years ago but it looks like turd now. Im sure my tv can eun that game without a console haha!

[Cortar]

I enjoy the changes. Its a game for fun, not the world series of baseball. This is the fifth game it was time for some radical changes, Halo- Hali Reach was getting stale.

 

Lastly

Map control=camping

Weapon control=power weapon camping.

I should nof have to play with a timer for weapon drops or go into forge and memorize all the spawn points to have a chance in the game.

 

You don't unless you are playing at an extremely high level of play. In halo 3 you could get to 50 without knowing the times.

 

Also I FTFY

[BritishGravy]

The only two things that I want them to change is the join mid way into matchmaking games and add in infection for fat kid games.

[thelegendofJohn117]

But I'd hate to break this to you people: it's never going back to the way it was. Ever. Everything needs a change. You can choose to follow it or move on to something else. Especially because it's under a new company, which is not entirely composed of Bungie members, as usually mistaken.

Thank you so much! people just don't seem to understand this. And if i understand correctly a working file share will be coming soon

[Final Sentence]

Halo CE <-- Seriusly? It might have been a good game 15 years ago but it looks like turd now. Im sure my tv can eun that game without a console haha!

 

Doesn't matter what a game looks like, it's how a game plays that keeps the game popular. The more they try at making Halo flashy, the crappier the games keeps turn out. CE>H2>H3>H4>Reach

[D-38 Boss]

I personally can see the appeal of reverting to the old games, But the truth is if Halo was made to feel the same way everytime it would feel stale, it wouldn't be fun, and there's a good chance the series wouldn't be as popular as it is. if you make the same game again and again you will lose a sizable chunk of your fanbase again and again, *Cough* *Cough* Callofduty...

 

Changing a game is like changing the layout of facebook for instance, people rage for about 2 weeks, than realize that (and yes there are exceptions) it's better than it was before in one way or another.

[Cortar]

I personally can see the appeal of reverting to the old games, But the truth is if Halo was made to feel the same way everytime it would feel stale, it wouldn't be fun, and there's a good chance the series wouldn't be as popular as it is. if you make the same game again and again you will lose a sizable chunk of your fanbase again and again, *Cough* *Cough* Callofduty...

 

Changing a game is like changing the layout of facebook for instance, people rage for about 2 weeks, than realize that (and yes there are exceptions) it's better than it was before in one way or another.

 

You should read my reply before posting useless drivel like this.

[LiQuid BioniX]

To the OP, you are defending the indefensible.

 

Halo 4 is not Halo, its Call of Duty.

 

You think all the sudden H4 is going to get better?

 

This is as good as good as it gets. The game is a beta. The maps suck. The game is jerky an laggy like hell. There is no rank system so you dont know if you are improving or not. 343 will release more sucky maps and make YOU pay for them cause they were too cheap to include them in the original release and the wanted to beat COD black ops to the punch.

 

DULL BORING YAWN!!!!!!!!

 

Putting this is big yellow text and being immature about it doesn't make it more true.

 

As far as the OP, you're absolutely right. I've been trying to say that for a while but I never actually could find the words Games need to change, it's how the industry works. If games stayed the same, everyone would go crazy...

[Cocoa]

 

 

You don't unless you are playing at an extremely high level of play. In halo 3 you could get to 50 without knowing the times.

 

Also I FTFY

I have to disagree. I have seen some of the worst spawn camping and rocket + sniper + overshield camping ever in Halo 3. Where I have literally spawned in and been sniped before I even take a step.

[Predalian5]

If the Kill cam is fixed, Then I'll have nothing to complain about