How Did The Forerunners Lose To The Flood And Thr Humans Beat Them!?

[Baeztoberfest]

Okay okay. So to start this off right you gotta take a look at the forerunners. Their technology was way stronger, they built the HALO rings for crying out loud. The Didact has some kind of Star Wars Force Powers. Promo Knights can't be taken over by the Flood... How with all that did they lose against the Flood but Humans beat them so easily? They can be eaten and used against the humans, the had our knowledge as a gravemind, they had Cortana in their pocket, and out weaponry is WAY INFERIOR on a mass scale than forerunner tech.

 

So can anyone explain how or why any of that makes sense?

[Azaxx]

Humans never defeated an entire Forerunner empire at its greatest.

Forerunners were so hurt after the war with the humans so were overwhelmed by the Flood. Note the Flood took 90% of the Forerunners fleet at the time of the Halo activation.

Prometheans were destroyed by gun fire, Flood can use weapons. So bang bang bang, *dead knight*

The Didact was the only Forerunner left. Compared to the trillions before the Ring Activation. We had an entire empire.

 

So that answers your questions.

[A71william]

Humans never defeated an entire Forerunner empire at its greatest.

Forerunners were so hurt after the war with the humans so were overwhelmed by the Flood. Note the Flood took 90% of the Forerunners fleet at the time of the Halo activation.

Prometheans were destroyed by gun fire, Flood can use weapons. So bang bang bang, *dead knight*

The Didact was the only Forerunner left. Compared to the trillions before the Ring Activation. We had an entire empire.

 

So that answers your questions.

The Diadact isn't the only one.

The Librarian? There's only a few left but there are Forerunners here and there.

Also counting A.I's that's another story!

 

Humans never defeated the Forerunners.

I suggest reading the books etc before asking questions...

[Baeztoberfest]

I never said the humans beat the forerunners. I said the forerunners lost to the flood but we somehow beat them? But were an inferior race. So... That doesn't make sense.

[Azaxx]

The Diadact isn't the only one.

The Librarian? There's only a few left but there are Forerunners here and there.

Also counting A.I's that's another story!

 

Humans never defeated the Forerunners.

I suggest reading the books etc before asking questions...

 

Didact is the only one accounted for. There probably is survivors in Dyson spheres. But no names are given.

Librarian is dead. 99.9999999999999% of all Forerunners are dead.

 

I never said the humans beat the forerunners. I said the forerunners lost to the flood but we somehow beat them? But were an inferior race. So... That doesn't make sense.

 

The Forerunners were weak when we beat them. And when they battled the flood, they were a MASSIVE empire covering a huge amount of the galaxy. Didact had Requiem and that's about it.

[Backdemon]

Ancient Humans didnt beat the Forerunnners. We took them by surprise and got a few lucky hits (from my interpretation). In the terminals

it show the human ship approaching the forerunner planet and attacking before the Forerunner fleet has time to respond. Forerunners were a tier one civilization who had nothing to fear, where ancient humans were running from an unstoppable all consuming force. We panicked and lashed out at any sign of the flood which created the hostilities. From my knowledge.

[BaconShelf]

Humans were using a flood powder for thousands of years for various things when it began to mutate and turn pets into flood. It proceeded to overwhelm the human colonies so they began to resettle on ones that forerunners had occupied. The firunners thought they were expanding and waged war. They won, but when the flood arrived, they weren't strong enough after the previous war. If humans hasn't been there, I believe the forerunners could have won.

[WonderWombat]

I never said the humans beat the forerunners. I said the forerunners lost to the flood but we somehow beat them? But were an inferior race. So... That doesn't make sense.

You are talking about the Didact's personal opinion right? There is your answer right there, personal opinion. He is basically spoiled.

 

Either way the humans defeated the flood because they injected like a third of their population with some virus, then left them to die. The flood attacked these people and died out, and to get away the humans took forerunner worlds and destroyed those that were infected by the flood.

 

From my understanding if it weren't for the flood the humans would be able to battle the forerunner and potentially win. It was the flood that caused the humans to lose in the first place, not the forerunner.

[Baeztoberfest]

You are talking about the Didact's personal opinion right? There is your answer right there, personal opinion. He is basically spoiled.

 

Either way the humans defeated the flood because they injected like a third of their population with some virus, then left them to die. The flood attacked these people and died out, and to get away the humans took forerunner worlds and destroyed those that were infected by the flood.

 

From my understanding if it weren't for the flood the humans would be able to battle the forerunner and potentially win. It was the flood that caused the humans to lose in the first place, not the forerunner.

 

I wasn't talking about Didacts opinion. His IC, Binary Rifles, Halo Arrays, and Boltshot (haha, yeah I went there) are proof enough that our tech is inferior. When the humans can make a Dyson sphere I'll agree that the Didact is spoiled. Until them I'm going to agree that they blow us out of the water. The sheer fact that they could DEVOLVE a civilization says to me that they should've been able to quell the flood with a small force, not like the humans who pretty much only needed three people. The Arbiter, MC, and Sergeant Major Johnson.

[BaconShelf]

 

 

I wasn't talking about Didacts opinion. His IC, Binary Rifles, Halo Arrays, and Boltshot (haha, yeah I went there) are proof enough that our tech is inferior. When the humans can make a Dyson sphere I'll agree that the Didact is spoiled. Until them I'm going to agree that they blow us out of the water. The sheer fact that they could DEVOLVE a civilization says to me that they should've been able to quell the flood with a small force, not like the humans who pretty much only needed three people. The Arbiter, MC, and Sergeant Major Johnson.

 

 

*sigh* there were ANCIENT humans, they were on par with the forerunners if not more powerful than them. They started to be overwhelmed by the flood so they settled forerunner planets. Forerunners thought this was aggression so went to war. Now, as powerful as they were, humans couldn't fight TWO powerful enemies. The forerunners devolved them for this war.

 

Now, I will put this in relatable terms. The forerunners defeated humanity but the humans had 'took down their shields, leaving them open to a headshot'. That headshot was the flood. Understand now?

[WonderWombat]

I wasn't talking about Didacts opinion. His IC, Binary Rifles, Halo Arrays, and Boltshot (haha, yeah I went there) are proof enough that our tech is inferior. When the humans can make a Dyson sphere I'll agree that the Didact is spoiled. Until them I'm going to agree that they blow us out of the water. The sheer fact that they could DEVOLVE a civilization says to me that they should've been able to quell the flood with a small force, not like the humans who pretty much only needed three people. The Arbiter, MC, and Sergeant Major Johnson.

What about the flood that took over ancient humans then acquire their armor and weapons. Or flood that targets civilian locations and immediately makes a massive army.

 

The flood is completely handicapped in the gameplay, so you have to think about the lore.

[BaconShelf]

What about the flood that took over ancient humans then acquire their armor and weapons. Or flood that targets civilian locations and immediately makes a massive army.

 

The flood is completely handicapped in the gameplay, so you have to think about the lore.

 

Just to expand on this, for every soldier the flood kills, it is added to their ranks. Their numbers rise as their enemies dwindle, then combine that they are extremely hard to kill and they don't need food, water, sleep etc...

They are almost the perfect army.

 

(Yes they starve but over years, not days)

[Baeztoberfest]

 

 

Just to expand on this, for every soldier the flood kills, it is added to their ranks. Their numbers rise as their enemies dwindle, then combine that they are extremely hard to kill and they don't need food, water, sleep etc...

They are almost the perfect army.

 

(Yes they starve but over years, not days)

 

Lol. Why act like I didn't know that? I saw that there were ancient humans from the waypoint vids, I got that much. But what I mean is that I beat halo with an assault rifle and an empty magnum and you want me to believe that the forerunners lost with all they're tech? Seems like a poorly constructed answer. Sure they were weaker from the war. But given the answer to the man that stopped them and the equipment HE HAD... It just doesn't add up. Lol.

[Vaulting♥Frog]

The Forerunners had too many things working against them.

 

1: The Forerunners were severely depleted in their Promethean ranks due to the war against humanity.

 

2: Whole Forerunner worlds were consumed fairly quickly by the Flood and on many worlds it seems the Flood already had a presence with out any Forerunners knowing so the Flood could attack on multiple worlds with no warning or defence.

 

3: The Forerunners did not understand the reality of the Flood until it was too late. The Flood would never be content with what it already had. It always hungered for more. That combined with the untolled horrors of different mutations would make each fight a new nightmare. Kind of like Javick from ME3 describing the fights against the Reapers.

 

4: The Forerunner AI turned on them with out them even realizing it. It was a crippling blow to their defence when that happend.

 

5: Their final solution in combat was Promethean AI's, but they were too little to late.

 

Humanity on the other hand beat the Flood in the future by shear dumb luck. The acts of John and Cortana were bairly enough to contain it. Realistically they shouldnt have been able to complete such a job.

 

The only thing going for humanity at this point is the Librarians gene-seeding which is actually in all of humanity, however John was here chosen successor in humanities defence. Each human has the potential to return to the genetic supremacy of their ancestors who fought the Forerunners and the Flood. It just needs to be unlocked (my theory, not fact). That will ensure humanity takes the mantle and watches over the galaxy.

[WonderWombat]

Lol. Why act like I didn't know that? I saw that there were ancient humans from the waypoint vids, I got that much. But what I mean is that I beat halo with an assault rifle and an empty magnum and you want me to believe that the forerunners lost with all they're tech? Seems like a poorly constructed answer. Sure they were weaker from the war. But given the answer to the man that stopped them and the equipment HE HAD... It just doesn't add up. Lol.

The flood had thousands of years to build up, prepare, and evolve against humanity and the forerunner 100,000 years ago.

 

In 2552 they had a few months to prepare. If the year went to 12552 then I'm sure no one would have beat the flood without the Halo rings.

[Baeztoberfest]

The Forerunners had too many things working against them.

 

1: The Forerunners were severely depleted in their Promethean ranks due to the war against humanity.

 

2: Whole Forerunner worlds were consumed fairly quickly by the Flood and on many worlds it seems the Flood already had a presence with out any Forerunners knowing so the Flood could attack on multiple worlds with no warning or defence.

 

3: The Forerunners did not understand the reality of the Flood until it was too late. The Flood would never be content with what it already had. It always hungered for more. That combined with the untolled horrors of different mutations would make each fight a new nightmare. Kind of like Javick from ME3 describing the fights against the Reapers.

 

4: The Forerunner AI turned on them with out them even realizing it. It was a crippling blow to their defence when that happend.

 

5: Their final solution in combat was Promethean AI's, but they were too little to late.

 

Humanity on the other hand beat the Flood in the future by shear dumb luck. The acts of John and Cortana were bairly enough to contain it. Realistically they shouldnt have been able to complete such a job.

 

The only thing going for humanity at this point is the Librarians gene-seeding which is actually in all of humanity, however John was here chosen successor in humanities defence. Each human has the potential to return to the genetic supremacy of their ancestors who fought the Forerunners and the Flood. It just needs to be unlocked (my theory, not fact). That will ensure humanity takes the mantle and watches over the galaxy.

 

Awesome. And the fact you described it as dumb luck kinda sums up my feelings toward it. I don't see the graveminds as a PLAN kinda species, more like eat everything in the galaxy kind of species. God forbid they ever mutate one of those dinosaur things on Reach... Lol.

 

On a side note someone said Captain Del Gravemind on another thread... This made me LOSE IT WITH LAUGHTER! I still laugh at that. The idea of Del Rio becoming a Gravemind. But I will ask was that what was going on with Captain Keyes? Are there ever Flood Hunters? I've never seen Flood Grunts either, or Flood Jackals. Or Flood Drones... Scary stuff I'm sure, but it had to be dumb luck.

 

How else did a handful of rag tag marines do what the forerunners couldn't? I'd like to visually see how that kind of fight would play out. In the third mission we saw covenant fighting Prometheans. In multiple occasions, the covenant always kick the crap out of the promo's.

 

I mean sometimes when that scenario plays out the promo's win. But that's rare. Would love to see Flood versus Promo. I mean Flood beat the crap out of Covenant in CE.

 

Halo CE is the only game where the Flood are portrayed as being FEARED.

 

And for a VERY OFF TOPIC SIDE NOTE... Would be cool to see a Gravemind prophet from Halo 3. I think it was Regret that the Arbiter killed at the end of Halo 3? Well what if The Flood reanimated the Prophets body into a Gravemind? That would be a creepy adversary.

[SykoWolf]

The flood had thousands of years to build up, prepare, and evolve against humanity and the forerunner 100,000 years ago.

 

In 2552 they had a few months to prepare. If the year went to 12552 then I'm sure no one would have beat the flood without the Halo rings.

True...but luck and skill also has their place within the reasons why the UNSC won....i mean even a single flood spore can kill a species

[BaconShelf]

The flood need a sufficient biomass in the host to feed off; Hunters are made of worms known as Lekgolo. The worms aren't good enough- ergo no flood hunters.

Grunts and jackals were in Halo Wars and on the map Abandon, there is flood Jackals in tanks. They're pretty creepy. But Drones have a shell/ exoskeleton that can protect them for a limited time.

[WonderWombat]

The flood need a sufficient biomass in the host to feed off; Hunters are made of worms known as Lekgolo. The worms aren't good enough- ergo no flood hunters.

Grunts and jackals were in Halo Wars and on the map Abandon, there is flood Jackals in tanks. They're pretty creepy. But Drones have a shell/ exoskeleton that can protect them for a limited time.

To go more into detail. I'm pretty sure the lack of a sophisticated brain makes the flood unable to infect the Lekgolo, and when alone the worm is considered non-sentient.

 

Grunts and Jackals have bodies that aren't strong enough to permanently support a flood form. Though I find this werid as Jackals are about the same size as a human.

[Baeztoberfest]

The flood need a sufficient biomass in the host to feed off; Hunters are made of worms known as Lekgolo. The worms aren't good enough- ergo no flood hunters.

Grunts and jackals were in Halo Wars and on the map Abandon, there is flood Jackals in tanks. They're pretty creepy. But Drones have a shell/ exoskeleton that can protect them for a limited time.

 

That's what I figured for the Hunters. I'd heard that a long time ago. Seems to me like even without the Halo rings those it would've been easy for the Promo's to compose the Flood inside their invincible fortress. The Flood (unless they capture a vessel) have no way to combat that kind of threat. It would've been so easy to just vaporize them.

[Vaulting♥Frog]

That's what I figured for the Hunters. I'd heard that a long time ago. Seems to me like even without the Halo rings those it would've been easy for the Promo's to compose the Flood inside their invincible fortress. The Flood (unless they capture a vessel) have no way to combat that kind of threat. It would've been so easy to just vaporize them.

 

In CE 343 states that the Flood dont particularly care about what they absorb as long as it has sufficent biomass to sustain them. Which makes me feel like they then turned the rest of the games into total crap. Its not "sentient life" that is in danger but all life. It absorbs any and all life with sufficent biomass to sustain itself. But no they changed this....

[PlexVanguard]

Are we talking pre-halo event humans? Or post-halo event? Well, the pre-halo event humans were fighting very small numbers of flood at a time, because they were vigilant. That being said, they encountered flood on a forerunner world, (And in trying to save the forerunners) they glassed the planet. This then prompted a massive war between both species which let the flood grow and prosper. The forerunner fleet was already decimated, so then they had trillions of flood to fight. (Also the flood makes more powerful mutations the longer they exist.) So the flood the forerunners fought were far more powerful. Simply put, they got overwhelmed.

 

Post-halo event humans only beat the flood because they fought small numbers of very primitive flood. Even with the gravemind, they had only been able to make some mutant strains. Had there been anymore, MC would stand no chance against the flood.

[Reptile]

Oh dear this thread has so many replies. I'm gonna stop reading them all and sum it up in what I know.

Forerunners created or helped the humans along when in race infancy

Eventually, the humans advanced

They became a space grade race, more advanced in SOME ways than current canon humans

Flood attacked

Humans run across the galaxy, conquering planets to stay alive

The forerunners saw this as a threat, Didact began not to trust them

The humans noticed a forerunner world infested by flood, they had no time to explain to the forerunners or to delay, so they cleansed the world

Didact and Librarian had a debate in court about whether the humans should be reduced back to infancy

Didact won the debate

Humans were reduced to cavemen, call onto the stage current human race

Human race reached advanced status again, yada yada yada, too much to write so I'll end here.

[WonderWombat]

That's what I figured for the Hunters. I'd heard that a long time ago. Seems to me like even without the Halo rings those it would've been easy for the Promo's to compose the Flood inside their invincible fortress. The Flood (unless they capture a vessel) have no way to combat that kind of threat. It would've been so easy to just vaporize them.

I don't know what you are missing.

 

The Fllod had already devastated the humans, so they had their technology when fighting the forerunner, and the humans at the time were arguably better than the forerunner. That combined with the floods nature should be unquestionable victory, which it was.

 

A single flood spore didn't just wonder onto a forerunner world and go from there.

[Baeztoberfest]

I don't know what you are missing.

 

The Fllod had already devastated the humans, so they had their technology when fighting the forerunner, and the humans at the time were arguably better than the forerunner. That combined with the floods nature should be unquestionable victory, which it was.

 

A single flood spore didn't just wonder onto a forerunner world and go from there.

 

I was just going based on what I've seen from gameplay. I haven't read the books but did some wiki research and have been playing Halo since launch day of Halo CE. I have beaten every game numerous times with skulls on, legendary, solo, you name it. And everytime the humans just stomp every alien force we fight, not always with ease, but inevitably the lore behind the game seems a little biased? Arguably it's because that's the point of a video game and I'm assuredly looking WAY too deep into it.

 

And I get what you are saying. I'm just having a hard time believing that. What happened to those Flood that had all that ancient human tech? And don't say killed with the firing of the Halo rings because if they can infest a Dyson sphere, they can survive. Not only that but just the sheer number of them... How did Humans live through the firing if the first rings and not Flood? How did Promo's lose with all their technological advancements like composers and halo rings? All we had was the Magnum, and assault rifle to go on. Haha. Really that's what we had. And we crushed them in Halo CE, and in Halo 3, three guys single handedly fought through hordes of Flood and devastated them. You're telling me Prometheans didn't have heroes of their own? Hell the Didact is more powerful than the chief and HE couldn't stop the Flood? Weapons aside he still has Jedi tricks that Chief doesn't have.

 

Granted. I know they were devastated, I get that. I know the Flood were much more powerful than the ones we've fought in game. I get that. I just disagree that that's enough evidence how and entire civilization FAR MORE SUPERIOR to ours lost yet we won. No ammount of luck could tell that story. There has to be more to it.

 

Maybe that will be answered in Halo 5 and 6? Who knows. But it makes me wonder...

 

And I apologize ahead of time if I'm coming off argumentative that's not my goal at all. I'm merely enjoying a conversation about the three races versus the Flood and why each either failed or succeeded.