Halo 4 Panopticon

[orangedrone]

 

\\_ PANOPTICON _//

 

Panopticon is an intense, symmetrical, arena-style map with 4 points of entry (RED, BLUE, YELLOW & GREEN). The layout is an unforgiving center structure surrounded by calm, scenic vistas.

 

The rest is self-explanatory..

 

Competitive map that supports: Slayer (2v2, 4v4), Multiteam (2v2v2v2, 3v3v3v3), FFA/Regicide, Flood, CTF (w/vehicles), KOTH and Oddball.

 

Download: Panopticon

 

*Unbiased comments/feedback is encouraged.

 

\\_ Created by ORANGEDRONE _//

[DebonairHalo]

Well this first pic is just insane...

[Zaelkyria]

This first pic is just ... Incredible. 

Can you put more screens please ? I don't have my Xbox so I cannot DL it ...

[Drizzy_Dan]

This definitely needs more screenshots. Although the first one is pretty, I'm not seeing how that screen door comes into play. Can you put up a map overiview and view from spawn points? And maybe some weapon spawns?

[orangedrone]

Thanks, yeah, I was just in a rush to get something up. I just finished the map yesterday and introduced it to the FNC (Friday Night Customs) crew. I'll be adding more pics shortly.

 

-O

[AbleSir Thomas]

The map has clean forging and interesting visuals but there are several issues.

• The teleporters are disorienting (even in forge).
• The shield doors may cause issues with players being trapped inside or outside the central structure.
• The layout of the central structure is very open (feels like a death trap).
• The lower level is very awkward and feels like a death pit ( teleporters and awkward ramps cause issues).
• Lots of right angles inside results in almost "tunnel vision". (it feels your being funneled around the structure.)

These are a few observations I've made by looking at the map in forge. However like most things in life "you never know till you try it" so i recommend you submit this to TNT. Then you can have my opinion, and the opinion of other forgers/players after a test.

[orangedrone]

Yes! Panopticon IS a death trap (hense: "unforgiving central structure" but, perhaps not a traditional "death trap".. SEE BELOW). So, you gotta bring your A-game.

 

It's meant to be a competitive map. Actually, let me say its meant to be a HIGHLY competitive pee-your-pants map. There aren't really any safe spots. And you know what? Thats good.

The lower level is meant to be kinda like a maintenance area. I don't know what "issues" would come from teleporters and ramps. These are your 12 options to get back up to the main level of the structure. The reason to venture down there is that's where many of the random drops occur. Or just to take quick shelter from getting shot at. (But, that's not going to be apparent in forge mode.)

In actual gameplay there is nothing disorienting about the teleporters. You go in them straight you come out the other side straight. Uniform at 45 degrees. It's impossible to get trapped by a shield door anywhere on this map. Additionally, everything is color-coded for the player to keep their bearings.

It's been run from everything from a 2v2 to a max game of 16 players and nobody has had any problems navigating the map. That's the beauty of a 4-sided, symmetrical, color-coded structure is that it's quickly readable from the very 1st time you play on it.

But, yeah if you just toured it solo in forge mode I guess all you can do is speculate. I would value your feedback more had you actually played competitively on the map (at least 2v2). I'm not trying to do stuff that's been done before. But, yeah I'll submit it wherever I need to get reviews based on actual gameplay.

-O

[kronicheadpain75]

I think this is an awesome map played it last friday. Way to go!

[Guest Psychoduck]

Yes! Panopticon IS a death trap (hense: "unforgiving central structure"). So, you gotta bring your A-game.

 

It's meant to be a competitive map. Actually, let me say its meant to be a HIGHLY competitive pee-your-pants map. There aren't really any safe spots. And you know what? Thats good.

 

The lower level is meant to be kinda like a maintenance area. I don't know what "issues" would come from teleporters and ramps. These are your 12 options to get back up to the main level of the structure. The reason to venture down there is that's where many of the random drops occur. Or just to take quick shelter from getting shot at. (But, that's not going to be apparent in forge mode.)

 

In actual gameplay there is nothing disorienting about the teleporters. You go in them straight you come out the other side straight. Uniform at 45 degrees. It's impossible to get trapped by a shield door anywhere on this map. Additionally, everything is color-coded for the player to keep their bearings.

 

It's been run from everything from a 2v2 to a max game of 16 players and nobody has had any problems navigating the map. That's the beauty of a 4-sided, symmetrical, color-coded structure is that it's quickly readable from the very 1st time you play on it.

 

But, yeah if you just toured it solo in forge mode I guess all you can do is speculate. I would value your feedback more had you actually played competitively on the map (at least 2v2). I'm not trying to do stuff that's been done before. But, yeah I'll submit it wherever I need to get reviews based on actual gameplay.

 

-O

Able and I have lots and lots of experience with this stuff.  We pick up a lot just from inspecting and analyzing a map's layout.  Sure, we can't tell everything about a map from doing so, but we've been doing this long enough to be able to tell roughly how well a map will play.  There are scenarios where we can clearly tell, beyond the shadow of any doubt, that something will not play well just from analyzing a map.  

 

Creating a competitive map is not about forcing players into a death trap.  It's about creating gameplay which forces players to use skill and team work to achieve victory.  I'll stop there, because I haven't looked at the map yet.  but, from this post it's clear that you're failing to understand how competitive maps work to some extent, and of course I trust Able's judgement.  I'll come back with some feedback later.

[orangedrone]

Able and I have lots and lots of experience with this stuff.  We pick up a lot just from inspecting and analyzing a map's layout.  Sure, we can't tell everything about a map from doing so, but we've been doing this long enough to be able to tell roughly how well a map will play.  There are scenarios where we can clearly tell, beyond the shadow of any doubt, that something will not play well just from analyzing a map.  

 

Creating a competitive map is not about forcing players into a death trap.  It's about creating gameplay which forces players to use skill and team work to achieve victory.  I'll stop there, because I haven't looked at the map yet.  but, from this post it's clear that you're failing to understand how competitive maps work to some extent, and of course I trust Able's judgement.  I'll come back with some feedback later.

 

Well, it definitely seems you are biased. Accusing me of "failing" before you or the other guy has even played the map. Not to mention how argumentitive and uninspiring a comment like that is. I definitely want to pull my TNT request now. If this is how you guys go out of your way to preface your future feedback I can only imagine how your actual feedback will be. So, yeah no thanks.. this is obviously the THFE show and not really about the maps.

 

Haters gonna hate

 

Thanks anyway but, I'll go off the feedback from those who have already played the map and who are open to new experiences.

 

[orangedrone]

Since everybody (including myself) has been incorrectly assigning the adjective "death trap" I decided to look it up.. haha. I was starting to get curious I viewed several Halo Reach "death trap" forge videos on YouTube.. - and yeah, while Panopticon may be an intimate arena-style map its definitly NOT a "death trap" there is plenty of cover in Panopticon! No one is forced or trapped anywhere!

[Blaq Cloud]

 You are not getting the some of the points able, and psycho are making which are valid. I do agree feedback from actual playtests are valid. But completely disregarding insight from other more experienced forgers is not wise. Especially when they have created maps which has made it into matchmaking in prior halo playlists.

 

I have the utmost confidence in able's feedback on the design of the map. Which could be verified through play testing. What you should do "as I do" is hit theater after ever playtest, and review the game from each player's POV. It gives you some understanding of what each player was experiencing.

 

I have the map in my queue to check it out as well.

[orangedrone]

 You are not getting the some of the points able, and psycho are making which are valid. I do agree feedback from actual playtests are valid. But completely disregarding insight from other more experienced forgers is not wise. Especially when they have created maps which has made it into matchmaking in prior halo playlists.

 

I have the utmost confidence in able's feedback on the design of the map. Which could be verified through play testing. What you should do "as I do" is hit theater after ever playtest, and review the game from each player's POV. It gives you some understanding of what each player was experiencing.

 

I have the map in my queue to check it out as well.

Wait what? How would you know they are valid?

 

I play every friday with upwards of 16 talented forgers. I would NEVER poo poo any of their insight.

 

Several of Able's points were not even accurate. (Ex: getting trapped inside or outside the structure due to sheild doors) This isn't even possible. I should know this more than anyone right? It's pure negative false speculation. Additionally, several of the others were not elobarated on. Neither of them played competitively on this map but, felt obligated to chime in and point out their percieved negative points. The second guy.. sight unseen!!!!!!!

 

I am a designer for a living in a professional setting. I am no stranger to giving and recieving constructive critisism. Been doing that for over a decade now. But, you have to play the map 1st competitively. Meaning your trying to kill the other team(s) not just walking around looking at the map whilst getting killed etc.. At least 2v2. (4v4 recommended) That goes for anyone. Otherwise, I can't listen to the feedback. Honestly, no one should.

 

Bottom line.. I don't care who you are.. you have to play it for your feedback to mean anything. Or don't play it. Makes no difference to me. But, don't just fly around in forge mode and come back here and start typing.

 

-O

[IR3CON]

I am a designer for a living in a professional setting. I am no stranger to giving and recieving constructive critisism. Been doing that for over a decade now. But, you have to play the map 1st competitively (not just fly around in forge mode and speculate). Meaning your trying to kill the other team(s) not just walking around looking at the map whilst getting killed etc.. At least 2v2. (4v4 recommended) That goes for anyone. Otherwise, I can't listen to the feedback. Honestly, no one should.

 

I downloaded the map because I found the front image to be spectacular and it's nice and all, but other than those cool looking doors, there is not much to the map + The term 'death trap' CAN be used to describe the central structure because it's what it is. While you have a large passage to go all the around the map, I doubt it will be used too often because it's a much longer route which players will avoid using and just go straight to the center for the action. Meaning that the whole gameplay of the map would be based inside of the map and very little of it outside. Even though it's an arena, players should be encouraged to use each part of the map, but what happens here is the same thing that happens on 'Abandoned' where everyone rushes to the central structure like a moth to a light bulb. I can assure you that this type of gameplay would not be very pleasant.

 

My advise would be to redesign the map. Do a couple of sketches. Keep the door design as it's the most accurate forerunner door out there, look at some other forerunner concepts and try to sketch out a better central design. While the map has great aesthetics on the outside, it lacks them on the inside of the map. Also make sure to encourage people to move around the map.

 

P.S. Sorry to be rude here, but do not use the term 'Professional' just yet.

[orangedrone]

I downloaded the map because I found the front image to be spectacular and it's nice and all, but other than those cool looking doors, there is not much to the map + The term 'death trap' CAN be used to describe the central structure because it's what it is. While you have a large passage to go all the around the map, I doubt it will be used too often because it's a much longer route which players will avoid using and just go straight to the center for the action. Meaning that the whole gameplay of the map would be based inside of the map and very little of it outside. Even though it's an arena, players should be encouraged to use each part of the map, but what happens here is the same thing that happens on 'Abandoned' where everyone rushes to the central structure like a moth to a light bulb. I can assure you that this type of gameplay would not be very pleasant.

 

My advise would be to redesign the map. Do a couple of sketches. Keep the door design as it's the most accurate forerunner door out there, look at some other forerunner concepts and try to sketch out a better central design. While the map has great aesthetics on the outside, it lacks them on the inside of the map. Also make sure to encourage people to move around the map.

 

P.S. Sorry to be rude here, but do not use the term 'Professional' just yet.

And again.. here we go with the reviews based on everything but, competitive gameplay. Please delete my map from your xbox.

 

Oh, and did you read the entire sentence where I used the word "professional" cause, it doesn't seem like it.

 

How I get people to use different parts of the map is by use of ordinance drops. But, again, again, and again.. you can't get that from flying around in forge. And as much as I'm sure you don't believe this.. you are speculating. (And kinda cheerleading too)

[IR3CON]

And again.. here we go with the reviews based on everything but, competitive gameplay. Please delete my map from your xbox.

 

Oh, and did you read the entire sentence where I used the word "professional" cause, it doesn't seem like it.

 

Sorry I was wrong. Don't use that word ever again lol

[orangedrone]

Sorry I was wrong. Don't use that word ever again lol

It was an adjective to the word "setting".. obviously.

[Guest Psychoduck]

Well then.  If you want to be ignorant and disregard feedback from the people you specifically submitted your map to, we won't waste our time on it.  I would have been happy to look at your map (and play it if this seemed worthwhile  and give you some actual feedback, but if you're going to be ignorant, not to mention childish. about it I won't bother.  This is such an unfortunate recurring theme in forgers, asking for feedback from those more experienced but then changing their minds when they realize that the feedback isn't the mindless praise they want to hear.  Able and I spend our time looking at hundreds of maps, we've been doing this for a while.  If you don't want to listen to our feedback, then you don't have to but don't attempt to insult us or our channel because you're too ignorant to listen.

[Blaq Cloud]

Just for the record competitive maps don't have random ordance drops. They rely on strategic advantage through positioning. i.e. If I hold this position I get "X" advantage over the opposing team. That aforementioned position would then be balanced by another position designed to counter it.

[orangedrone]

Well then.  If you want to be ignorant and disregard feedback from the people you specifically submitted your map to, we won't waste our time on it.  I would have been happy to look at your map (and play it if this seemed worthwhile  and give you some actual feedback, but if you're going to be ignorant, not to mention childish. about it I won't bother.  This is such an unfortunate recurring theme in forgers, asking for feedback from those more experienced but then changing their minds when they realize that the feedback isn't the mindless praise they want to hear.  Able and I spend our time looking at hundreds of maps, we've been doing this for a while.  If you don't want to listen to our feedback, then you don't have to but don't attempt to insult us or our channel because you're too ignorant to listen.

Yeah, no.. I'm good. Please don't give me anymore feedback. Not that I can't handle it or anything.. The great irony here is that I actually am very PRO feedback/criticism. Only because, I received soo much of it before anyone here even played the map did I get turned off. Additionally, a few of Able's statements (that you blindly defended) were false.. Inaccurate. Maybe that was accidental.. who knows. But, doesn't really matter. That's fine. You all can apparently operate like that. But, please let me be absolutely clear:

 

I no longer want any THFE feedback. I pulled my TNT post earlier today.

 

It's already a weak community.. and if you guys keep on operating this way it's only going to get weaker. You kinda hinted to this yourself.. you prematurely swat more people away than you help. Is that really not lame? Maybe we are only to think your maps are cool?

 

Who knows.. Who cares..

 

Peace,

 

-O

 

Just for the record competitive maps don't have random ordance drops. They rely on strategic advantage through positioning. i.e. If I hold this position I get "X" advantage over the opposing team. That aforementioned position would then be balanced by another position designed to counter it.

Mine does.

[Flyingshoe ILR]

Well... this was a pretty sad read. This is at least the 3rd time I've seen where a forger comes in and ignores feedback based on the argument that "They didn't play it so their feedback is invalid." Let me say this now: This argument is a Cop Out. A lot can be told about how a map will play by looking through it in forge with an analytical eye. Not EVERYTHING, but quite a lot. The arguments that "My friends are all really good forgers/ pro players and they have played it and like it" is also based on nothing. Your friends may not be as good as you think and they may not always be right. In the end, you are only hurting yourself by doing this, as you will not improve.  

 

Oh, but wait, you've been doing design in a number of programs for X number of years, haven't you? You're a level designer yourself, so you must be good at forging! No, once again, this argument holds no water. Other programs and games do not necessarily transfer into forge. Look at the forge maps Bungie put into Matchmaking at the start of Reach. I've had this line pulled on me a number of times now, and in the end it does not matter how many years you've been doing this or how many maps you have made. What matters is your ability to design well for this sandbox in this game. What also matters is your attitude, and for someone who says they "actually [are] very PRO feedback/criticism." you haven't shown much ability to react well to it at all. You are not expected to agree with all criticism, it is a rule of thumb to take it with a grain of salt, thank the person, then decide for yourself if it is correct or not. 

 

The bottom line is this: You've come to this site asking for help from people who have proven that they understand forge and the Halo sandbox. Your way of looking at feedback is inherently flawed and you have decided to use this opportunity to insult half of the people who are here to help you. This is not acceptable. You have proven through your previous comments that, despite what you say of yourself, you are not mature enough to accept criticism and learn from others in a sensible manner. I should hope that you are not this way in any actual professional design scenes. I'm sorry this conversation had to go this way at all, but you have proven that you cannot handle being in this environment. 

 

Here is a list of sentences you may want to re-read. They were some of the... "highlights" for me. 

 

• "Haters gonna hate"

• "I would NEVER poo poo any of their insight."

• "Yeah, no.. I'm good"

[orangedrone]

Well, the haters gonna hate thing speaks to people dawging a map before playing..(and Psychoduck sight unseen calling me a failure) So, yeah that's kinda a logical thing for me to deduct there. Not being familiar with all the hidden rules of course

 

The "I would never poo poo any of their insight" is a factual true statement.. as I would do nothing of the sort. (Not sure if you were taking that out of context or not though)

 

And finally, the "yeah, no.. I'm good" simply means "No, thank you" Not sure what you took that to mean.. but, that's what it means.

 

It's unfortunate sure, but, not really. Think I got bent out of shape by Able's incorrect statements.. that no one has since commented on.. I'm just suppose to pretend what he said was in-fact true. Even when issues he listed weren't actually issues at all. (EX: getting trapped by sheild doors.) But, I still took his advise and posted in TNT. But, then Phychoduck came in without even so much as touring the map in forge and starting in on me using words like "FAILURE". So, that's when I decided no thank you. Not AT ALL because I was afraid of any formal feedback but, because.. that's already the wrong way to operate. IMO. Their collective minds were already made up before even playing it. That's called being biased. I state way up above that I don't want biased feedback.

 

So, forgive me if I lost interest. I'm sure someone somewhere sees it from my point of view.. if not, then, get me out of this twilight zone!

 

But, yeah... actually I am pro feedback/criticism... but, as I tried to state earlier I know the difference between that and being gang-banged.

 

-O

[kronicheadpain75]

WOW what happened to this thread? This is supposed to be a positive thing people. I can see where both sides are coming from. Buuuuuut, there is no reason why anyone has to conform to anything OR get bent out of shape either.

[Creative Gaming Inc.]

I saw that screenshot, and I cried.

So yeah, the screenshot made me cry, but you're acting pretty arrogant. An extremely esteemed Forger is giving you feedback to help complete your map and make something truly impressive, and you just say "Haters gonna hate" and act as if he's no idea what he's talking about?

Honestly, you're just really getting on my nerves now. You get a list of suggestions from someone who wants to help you, and you accuse them of being biased and insulting your map! It's CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM, and you're not going to have any success without it! You're acting as if your way of looking at it is the ONLY way, and time and time again, you consecutively imply that you're a much more talented Forger than these, and that their opinions and suggestions are naive when they clearly have tons of experience! Good Lord, your arrogance is unbearable!

And again.. here we go with the reviews based on everything but, competitive gameplay. Please delete my map from your xbox.

 

I can't believe you said that! That is literally THE most pretentious, arrogant thing I've ever seen on any forum! You feel that your map is too good to be on someone's hard drive? You come right out and say it, no less? You downright deny feedback from such successful Forgers as if you're some map design God and they some naive children? Good God, I can't even describe your arrogance! I hope you're satisfied knowing that no sensible one will look at your maps again, prick.

[Drizzy_Dan]

WOO HOO this thread has been hot all day! Who's got the map in possession and wants to test it right now so I can have a word on this with no professional, semi-professional, or even novice skill in Forge and give my own review from experience!?

 

By the way I'm posting now instead of earlier just to let everyone know we're not gonna get into bad language. Prick is as far as it goes guys.

 

Seriously though who has it and will test with me!