New xp and rank system for halo 4.

[gollum385]

Halo reach introduced a system that many people dislike. The credit system and the arena system.

The credit system means that a persons rank is dependant on the amount they play (and also a bit of luck from the slot machine), rather than based on skill or winning games. The arena system required people to continuously play games, and punsihed those who has teammates leave with poor ratings. Whilst the idea had potential, it generally didn't work, and the fact you couldn't play ranked objective and there was only 2 (now 1) playlists for it proves it had problems.

 

I have some ideas to not only fix the ranking system, but also the experience system, which is not as harsh as halo 3, but will still allow for skill to shine through.

 

Firstly, the ranking system. For anyone who has played fifa online, the system works, by calculating the score of the match at the end, the teams that both people played as (whose was better, if any) and the skill of both players before the start of the match.

I feel this method would be great for halo matchmaking.

 

Imagine a line between 0 and 9999. Every 100 points would count as a level (0-99 level 1, 100-199 level 2... 9900-9999, level 99). Whatever your points are, this is the level you lie in. Everyone would start at level 1, like other games, and work their way up from there.

 

The system would work as follows. Like fifa, the final score would come into the equation. If you are all playing people of equal points (both teams equal) and you lose 50-0, that is a crushing defeat for people of alleged equal skill. Both teams will increase and decrease a large amount. Your individual score would also come into the equation. If again the same situation applies, but you lose 50-49, then both teams would in the first situation go up and down equally. But if one member of the losing team pluses 20, and the others all minus 7 (a combined total of -21), it is clear that he is better than not only his team, but probably many of the opposing team, he too would probably go up alot.

 

In the case of the teams being unequal (although hopefully trueskill would prevent this generally) imagine there is a team with all level 60's, and the other team are all level 40's. If the second team lost 50-49, it is clear that this is closer than the levels suggest. In this scenario the 60's would most likely go down a bit, and the 40's up (although the 40's will go up more than the 60's go down).

 

A combination of the team score, the individual score, the team skills and the individual skill will all come into account when calculating how much each person goes up or down (kind of like arena, but using the scores of the level aswell as the in game scores as a calculation). Note assists would also help contribute to an individuals score, (if the team lose 50-49, and the guy has no kills but 49 assists, it is clear he was a big part in the teams almost victory) For objective, the victory margins will also be looked at (eg no captures vs 5, or no time with the oddball etc) In terms of an individuals performance, kd will always play a part, with objective achievements providing bonuses to a teams and your scores ( when averaged out this would then be similar scoring to slayer games). Other bonuses such as certain medals achieved (perfection or accolades such as mvp could also be used possibly)

 

This would be implemented in all ranked playlists. As an added feature, there will be an average rank, based off how good you are across all playlists. Too often people in halo 3 were a 50 in doubles, but couldnt get there in lone wolves for example. Now your success will be judged across all games to get your overall rank, which can also be used as a good guideline to matchmake in scoial.

 

A possible idea is also for a players points to decrease if they do not play x amount of games a day/week (such as 1 games a day/5 a week). This wouldnt be much, maybe 5 points a day/ 25 a week for example, but would mean that if people got to the high ranks, they have to at least play it occasionally to maintain at that level. Too often people in halo 3 reached 50 with the help of someone, and never played it again. Preventing that would be good. Would also mean if someone didnt play for a while there skill would not be so high, so they would be matched against people a bit lower in the rankings.

 

The experience system would work based on an out of 10 points per game. There would be a distribution of exp throughout the gametype (could be different per gametype). This will mean people who did better in the playlist will get better rewards for there work, and this will show in their service record (kind of like win/loss record, which should also be shown). For example the distribution in a slayer gametype could be as follows:

2 points for winning a game (therefore incentive to win)

2 point for being mvp for your team (based on best k'd)

2 point for being mvp overall (based on kd)

1 point for most kills

1 point for most assists

1 point for least deaths

1 point for playing a complete match

 

This way it is clear that usually the best people (the winners, the mvp's) will get more experince for there work than others, but everyone gets some sort of recognition. Obviously the above would be subject to change, based on people's views.

 

For other gametypes most of those would apply, but maybe aswell as kd things such as most time on the oddball, most flag captures or just for capturing a flag or things such as stopping paople with the flag/cpaturing a territory could also be taken into account, again breaking a gametypes down into a way that they can all be quantified equally, whilst reqarding players for the thigns most important in that gametype.

 

Note if the armoury returns, a credit system for matchmaking campaign firefight would be welcome, but not in terms of calculating your rank. Also the rank you are in ranked is absed on exp and level, so people who want to be generals (or the higest rank (eg eclipse or spartan or whatever) have to get to 9990-9999 points, and a certain amount of exp, (meaning you have to play so much to get it (cant boost)) This means each rank has a level, aswell as having an onverall rank, based on the average and your total of exp (agian would need so much (more than normal playlists). For social playlists it would work like the halo 3 method, where you have a rank in the playlist based on the total exp.

 

Quitting games, another issue with halo, would result in

1) no exp, and xp removed from the user (the exp of a user would never come into account when calculating ranked, and so people could not boost by quitting etc) A set points deduction in ranked, say 100 points (a level).

2) the user being bloacked from joining an online game until the curent game is completed (at all times)

 

People's opinions on these methods would be greatly appreciated. I think they are good ideas which match halo's previous systems while also looking at the rewards based on how individuals and the team have performed together. People's ideas on what else could be done would also be welcome. I really hope 343 get this system right, as i feel it was one of my main dislikes of halo reach.

[Rafter]

Ok, nice idea, but I have some regards in a few things:

 

First: The thing you talked about needing to play to maintain his skill is logical, thou, the timelines should be a lot longer, not everyone can play everyday or everyweek.

 

Second: about quitters; I look high to how the creators of LOL dealed with this situation:

 

If you quit (no matter if it is because you wanted or because you had a network problem, you CAN easily join the game in progress but CAN'T play any other game, I tottaly agree with this.

 

Moreover, I don't think that skill should be affect or your credits (you just lose the opprtunity to earn more(well, maybe skill could be)) (I know people with lot's of connection problems). Though you should be punished by quitting too many games, just like bungie does.

 

I think that's all for now.

 

Nice idea,

Rafter

[gollum385]

THanks for the post. Yea I did put that just as an example. That's why I put week, as I do know people don't play 24/7. I just want to make the point that a rank system should at least encourage the people at the top to continue to play, otherwise they get to the high ranks and stop, which doesn't mean they have to continue to prove they are the best. It also stops people boosting to 50 and staying therem or selling of accounts on. You actually need to be good to stay there.

 

As for the second point, extending your idea it would be good if a teamate went afk if they were kind of booted from the game, so they don't hinder the team, but they can rejoin at any point. Definately not allowing them to join other games should be enforced.

 

Finally I think if they could detect why you quit would be cool, but at the end of they day, people would quit ranked if they thought the loss was bigger than the penatly, so it needs to be enforced. Blocking them from the next game is fine for a loss of connection, as you have to reconnect anyway. As for credit exp blocked, maybe just not give them any for that match, or just a small exp penalty. Maybe as credits won't be the ranking system credit jackpots could return, and bonuses could be done absed on number of games completed.

 

At the end of the day, this game will be out at the end of 2012, and it is getting to the point where if you want to play games online you need at least a semi decent connection, so unless you could tell if they quit or lost connection, it would be at the sacrifice of a small number of people who lose connection to the larger number who quit.

[Rafter]

THanks for the post. Yea I did put that just as an example. That's why I put week, as I do know people don't play 24/7. I just want to make the point that a rank system should at least encourage the people at the top to continue to play, otherwise they get to the high ranks and stop, which doesn't mean they have to continue to prove they are the best. It also stops people boosting to 50 and staying therem or selling of accounts on. You actually need to be good to stay there.

 

(...)

 

At the end of the day, this game will be out at the end of 2012, and it is getting to the point where if you want to play games online you need at least a semi decent connection, so unless you could tell if they quit or lost connection, it would be at the sacrifice of a small number of people who lose connection to the larger number who quit.

 

Agree, people on the top should need to prove how good they are, moreover, 343i's site should have a ranking of the 10 best people or of the 20 best.

(If my ideas here go ahead:

Meaning: in multiplayer, Halo 4 should have maps and gametypes inside SWAT (which I think should change the name to ODST) in which people could play smth like COD, Battlefield, MOH, etc.

A classic Halo group of playlists: Very classic Halo with the needed palylists.

And a new type of Halo: with the things fans like me would like to see, again, with the obvious playlists.;

And you have a different character for each group of playlists, your ranking (skill and possibly credits/exp) should be separated one's from the others, and if they had 3 or 4 campaigns (One CD only for the campaign)(smth similar to Alien vs predator)(a spartan, and ODST, an elite and a Brute (or, if the forruners appear, a forruner) campaig), each campaing should earn credits for each different group of playlists.

 

Is sme didn't understand please say, i'll explain it again.

 

Rafter

[Master Chief]

Halo 3 rank system would be good but i like the reach one.

[gollum385]

Thanks for the comments. I like the idea of cod/ other games having features implemented in halo. I know there are an awesome range of cod/ gears maps in halo reach made by people, but the custom variants don't quite match what is needed to make them as similar.

 

And I agree that people need to prove there skill. And the overall average from every ranked skill would be the best indicator of the best players, as it would be hard for the top players to be top in everything.

 

Master Chief could you explain what you liked about halo 3 and reach systems. Why do you prefer reach? What is good/bad about my idea in relation to that?

[sheep side]

All people wanted was a record that consists on Ranked games exp and social games and exp and custom games. BRING BACK THE HALO rank system it works only if bungie listened to the players who played halo 3 instead of five year old kids youd have a succesful game

[343BettrNotFckUpHalo]

I think that they should go back to Halo 3's ranking system, EXCEPT if you lose a few games in a row you dont get an exp point taken away, that was like a huge kick in the nutts. and i dont like how you have to save up a **** load of credits to by sweet armour, that was a highly gay idea of them. just sayin

[gollum385]

What do you mean when you say if you lose a few games you lose an exp? Does that refer to quitting/losing connection, or losing a level in ranked?

[Spectral Jester]

Or we can use the BPR rating

Doesn't this track everything from kills, deaths, betrayals etc

[gollum385]

What is the BPR Rating? How does the system work. What is different from reach/halo3/my proposed idea?

[Rafter]

Thanks for the comments. I like the idea of cod/ other games having features implemented in halo. I know there are an awesome range of cod/ gears maps in halo reach made by people, but the custom variants don't quite match what is needed to make them as similar.

 

And I agree that people need to prove there skill. And the overall average from every ranked skill would be the best indicator of the best players, as it would be hard for the top players to be top in everything.

 

Check my two posts here: http://www.343industries.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=452&start=40

(it's the first post in this page (page 5) and the "colorfull" post in the end)

 

Please, give opinions, 343i, please say smth,

Rafter

[gollum385]

Some good ideas in there rafter. I think something that people should be careful of though is creating too many playlists or options which are similar to other games. Whilst i'd like custom options to allow that sort of thing to be generated, you have to remember what the core features of a game should be, and i'd rather 343i get those right than add too many alternate gametypes etc.

 

I loved things like vip and eliminatio, and many gametypes from 3 and reach that never really appear in the mm system anymore, and i'd worry more about reintroducing things like this and getting them right, than adding gametypes similar to other games, even if the ideas are quite cool.

 

Thanks

[gollum385]

Thanks for the voting. It is nice to see that people think that my/a similar idea would be a good way to implement this system in reach. I'd like to see if people can spot flaws in my idea, or how it could be improved so that it would be the system best for halo 4.

[gollum385]

For those who says the system might need tweaks, do people know what tweaks these may be. It is interesting to see that people haven't commented on the fifa style points system to determine rank. Is that because people know it works well, or think it just makes sense?

[az2d]

i agree with reach's **** ranking system, a person can have the highest rank possible and stil suck or play average, it only indicates that he plays a damn lot. i was really dissappointed in this because you couldn't even downrank, thus people leave when it starts to look like their losing, wich causes unpleasant gameplay, atleast for me it does. go play a few games of reach and you'll see.

basically the reach rank system = * play this much time to receive your next rank up*

so for the love of god im really hoping H4 will have a ranking system similar to Halo 2, were people with a high level were scary and you knew they were good ( or a modder/standby'er etc )

 

anyway please fix a ranking system with levels like halo 2 based on skil and not how much time you invest in the game.

[gollum385]

Yea definately I agree the reach system was awful. The credit/armory idea isn't bad, but that shouldn't be how you determine your rank.

 

I like the exp system from halo 3. It meant social games also had a meaning, and were still competitve, as there is still something to fight for. I also agree that halo 3 there were too many 50's. Halo 2, you'd be lucky to get to the 30's, it was that competitive.

 

My system is kind of a combination of both, with an evolved exp system to also show the more skilled/better players in a game.

My rank system from 0-9999 would use calcultions which could in a way be seen to the people playing how well people have done. To get to the top you have to do consistently well, against any opponent, proving you should be there. And if you do get to the 9999 limit (something which i think should be very hard, limited to the best of the best) there is still this method that means you have to continue to play at that level, or risk going down after so long (stops this stupid 50 business we got in halo 3). Also your overall rank being an average of all the ranked playlists would encourage everyone to play every playlist if they want the best rating, something that only the best players are good at doing.

[starshot36]

i agree with above but im going to emphasize. credits and the armory system should stay in the game whilst Gollums idea should be implemented with a couple of tweaks and twists. for every exp you recieve it should be multiplied by like 1.5 or something just an example. So while we have the best of both rank systems at the same time having a new system altogether

[teken]

i like both halo 3 and halo reaches ranking system, they both have problems. If on halo 3 you had a bad night you could go down 6 ranks. they should combine the systems to make something that takes into account bad connections, bad gaming night and the little 5 year old pr*ck that spends his time trying to kill his own team.

 

Also i liked that fact you could buy armour in halo reach and i didn't like that way you got armour in halo 3

[gollum385]

Thanks for the comments starshot

[Shameful Ninja]

i say just like halo 3, have 2 types of playlists. one will be a money ranking system to buy armour and such and the other will be this idea

[gollum385]

Thanks for the comments shameful ninja. I am not saying the credit and armoury idea is bad, in fact along with commendations it is a good system, giving points for playing games, getting kills and reaching achievements.

 

I hope these make a return, with a wider variety of armour (i disliked how the later armour just made your spartan look more chunky with stupid attatchments, rather than just cooler armour designs) and also allow for elites to be fully customised in the same way (and brutes or other playable characters. see my thread on this issue http://www.343industries.org/forum/index.php?/topic/313-brutes-and-playable-characters-in-halo-4/)

 

I'd also like to see even more commendations, and maybe some which are harder to get (so there is something that you have to aim to get good at to achieve, rather than just having to play so long)

 

I think the problem was is that apart from arena, this system dictated your rank. How long you played, or how good you were at collecting credits (farming etc) does not show this.

 

Even in the case of social, the idea of a playlist rank based off exp (like halo 3) is appealing. Obviously my system changes the exp slightly. then the ranked system i proposed comes in. These playlists will have a rank based on your skill (a number), and this will contribute to your overall rank, which is based on an average of the points in each playlist, combined with your total exp. I think the rank system should also have a rank for that playlist, but maybe this is based on a combination of the rank in that playlist and your exp in that playlist. Maybe both could when matchmaking, your playlist rank (both symbol and number for ranked) in silver, and your total rank in gold.

 

Obviously if people think this sort of idea needs tweaking, or how it could be better shown in game (things like win loss % and k/d ratios for ranked and social and overall are things i would love to see in your service record) please let me know.

[MuTeD DeSiRe]

BRING BACK normal levels. No XP, who cares about the fact that you have someone such as now with reach who is a general, but sucks, levels is all that matter, that is it. XP is dumb and useless it only shows the no lifers

[gollum385]

When you say normal levels, do you mean the standard 1-50? if so, is there a reason that my system doesn't appeal to you. As for xp, i think the xp system in halo 3 was good. It allowed players to show how much they had played, but also was based on winning, meaning those with a high xp had to at least be good enough to win often. I think my exp system is good as whilst it does offer exp just for playing etc, it offers more exp for those who win, but also those who do well, irrelevant of which team they are on. This means people who are better will be shown to be better. Along with other stats like win %, k/d ration on your service record it will be a great way for people to see how good a person is. If in objective gametypes the exp is also awarded based on things like mvp (most flag captures etc) it is an opportunity to encourage people to play the gametypes properly, rather than just playing for kills or whatever.

[gollum385]

Does anyone else have ideas for improvements on the system i proposed, or a system of their own they think would work better?