Ordnances are a bad thing

[Half_Nalgene]

Hi I'm new here! Nice to meet you all. 

 

Pretty much, ordnances ruin halo 4's  4v4 team slayer, that is the only problem I really have with halo 4 that cannot be in Halo 5's TS. Big Team is another thing, I just had to say that I wish 40 lashes against any publisher who just casually tosses in a poorly conceived ordnance idea to such a well respected community.

 

Halo's Team slayer is unique because it fits a niche that no other game can fill. Basically, it is not call of duty where 2 shots kill you. It takes time, teamwork, and strategy to get a kill in this game, making it not just a game but a true SPORT. Better than basketball in my opinion for just a competitive game, and no other video game comes close. That's why 343 should let CoD be CoD and keep Halo what it is.

 

Making TS more noob friendly with ordnances is like giving competitive basketball players "Moon-Shoes" for scoring a 3 pointer. It breaks the pureness and timelessness that once was Halo Team Slayer and makes it essentially Mario Kart. If there is one game that should not change its core mechanics of having predictable gun kill times and accountable weapons on the battlefield, it is Halo. No sport, erm video game, should ever really change even 1000 years from now, using basketball again as an analogy. Call of Duty is not like Basketball sort of like Halo. IMO, Halos 1-reach should be next to "sport in the dictionary" but ordnances in 4 basically ruined that. 

 

I never call ordnances and I've played 'lo for like 4 years. I'm in college, just thing it would be cruel, no stupid, to not deny ordnances were rushed and poorly thought out, and shouldn't be in the next Halo game. I guarantee they will be just for 343's ego's sake, but they should be at least watered down to just be an ammo/grenade refill. I don't care, I feel like the sport analogy is the best reason why I am right about this and anyone else is essentially dead wrong. If they disagree, why don't they learn from Halo history what is better and turn to CoD instead.

 

I am mad about losing a powerhouse of a series that has no true relatives. 343, I shame thou and ordnances better had be much different. Just my 2 cents, had to say that.  >

[AnimeAddict]

well they are horrid but they were poorly executed  because the ordinance were a lame attempt at what call of duty did with the Care Package the problem is that there is a smaller timer between call in and deliverance with the care package  you have to wait not only for the care package to come to where ur at but for it to drop and on top of that you also have to capture it which takes about 3-7 seconds

[Half_Nalgene]

Yeah, I didn't know that but do now. I always preferred Halo to CoD though, and think that poorly thought out ordnances were a primary example of game developers procrastinating. Designing Halo is a serious undertaking, and in my opinion, even if it takes more time to see H5, I am all or that if it means better development.

[ShockGazm]

As adding new ideas into Halo which evidently has to be done with a new upcoming game, Ordnance's were a good idea. But, it's not Halo and I think 343i should stick to what Halo multiplayer is about. I hope they stick to Bungie's roots regarding multiplayer, I don't want to see anything like this in Halo 5. I wouldn't say they're somewhat taking ideas from Call of Duty, just because COD is a big game (Still unbelievable), it doesn't mean they came up with all the ideas but as I said, stick to the core of what made Halo amazing.

[Is not JL]

My problem with ordnance isn't that they're there because it's just rewarding good players, but 1. If you're bad, you shouldn't be getting as much, 2. it should not be random.

 

The bad player should not be getting an incin cannon while the good player gets speed boosts and needlers. The randomness just isn't right; because THAT is giving moon shoes to players.

 

(Also, this is a community forum, not 343i's official forum, but hey. You don't start a war each time you post criticism here.)

 

Ordnance was another thing that showed a '1 step forwards 2 steps back' action in Halo 4 - it's a great idea, one that could be amazing when implemented right, but then 343 kinda poopoo'd it, and thye should definitely clean it up and do it better the next Halo game.

[Yoshi1176]

JL is right, the ordnance drops were not bad I like them and so did others. But the rewards that come down should be in comparison to how the person plays. You play better you get more powerful weapons, you play badly you get pulse grenades.

 

You should be rewarded for playing better than another player.

[Vaulting♥Frog]

Ok I will say I am a bit miffed. Who exactly is to say what is and isn't Halo? What is and isn't Halo is a personal opinion and has no bearing on any community level. If you don't like it then fine, but that does not mean it is not Halo. If that opinion determined what Halo then how many versions of Halo have been released? How many would have to be created? One for every consumer out there, that's how many. The notion is idiocy.

 

The fact of the matter is that it is in the game. No ifs, ands or buts about it. A person saying "it doesn't feel like Halo" or "it isn't Halo" is immaterial. The individual wants and preferences are mute. As it is a part of Halo 4 it is a part of Halo. There is no escaping this. If you don't like it, that is fine. However liking or disliking it is another story entirely.

 

Sorry but I had to say that. It really does tick me off when people say things like that.

 

That being said, Ordnance could have been done better. I enjoy the random weapon however there should only be one random weapon, then grenade selection and a power up selection. And yes they need (in my eyes) to make adjustments as to how fast an individual can get a drop. Though as far as I can tell there is a difference on how fast the meter fills up between kills and assists.

 

There is a problem however, if a player is dominating a game with kills then they are constantly getting power weapons which leaves the other players little to no chance at survival. It is an extremely tricky thing to balance. What they have now is a good start but I fear of too many so called "improvements" that may actually make things worse.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the addition to the game. It makes it so you have to do more planning than before. Account for more than what you can see on the map. I enjoy that aspect. I find however that the majority of "fixes" and complaints about it are directed more towards giving that individual all the advantage, but that is human nature I suppose.

 

Is it a good addition? I think so. Does it need work? Absolutely. This can be said about any games features however.

[Unease Peanut]

They experimented with something new in the Halo franchise. And they made good effort in my opinion. It gives you a chance to strike back at the enemy who completely dominating the map and spawn killing your entire team over and over again.

[Half_Nalgene]

JL is right, the ordnance drops were not bad I like them and so did others. But the rewards that come down should be in comparison to how the person plays. You play better you get more powerful weapons, you play badly you get pulse grenades.

 

You should be rewarded for playing better than another player.

 

I hear what your saying. I agree because I am always the best player and I believe I should be awarded for that more than the next guy, is that so much to ask? 

And another thing…. I suppose ordnances could work if they were the same on each map, like each player got a SAW 3 minutes into the match, and then maybe an ammo refill 7 minutes in. Just an example. Still, IMO ordnances ruin the MLG/team sport feel of Halo that NO OTHER game could even come close to because of Halo's longer kill times, and anyone who has played before knows what I am talking about. Innovation isn't really necessary in Halo TS, and I am pretty certain of that. I may sound closed minded by shunning others opinions, but I think those who disagree are too closed minded to see how changing the randomness of halo is like the moon shoes example in basketball. "Team Sports" (which Halo TS very much is) don't need to change to be the same great game. Look at a basketball game now vs 70 years ago, even though the future makes everything look better on TV, the stats were all the same, the sport was just as good, and even though the tech is better now, that doesn't mean ball players need to innovate the core mechanics of the game. Not now, not ever. And Halo 4 TS is, believe it or not, indeed a fundamentally perfect example of a "Team Sport" in much the way basketball is. That's why I am so closed on my opinion of this issue. However, anyone who fails to consider my comparison of halo to a team sport (think MLG competitions, pro sponsors, legit stuff, etc.) is essentially not hearing what I am saying and not addressing the meat of my argument directly. Put basketball in --> Halo's shoes basically, and you can see clearly how this ordnance thing, especially as random as it is, is a crime against competitive players. The logic of my argument is undeniably there, and I am not the only one who feels betrayed that this amazing game is now ruined for the sake of unnecessary innovation by 343, as could be seen in reach with AA's (not that those are that bad anyways). SO if you want to argue, tell me why, in essence, basketball should change fundamentally. This is an MLG lifestyle people, not some crash bandicoot gimmick of a series.

hey I'm back after a 5 minute rant break….

 

actually now that i think about it, I like AA's as they are basically, and if I can accept that "BS dynamic" (which I still like and want to be in H5) Then I guess why couldn't I accept ordnances. Well really I could if 343 doesn't obviously procrastinate on such a serious addition in H5 like they did in H4. Like I said, I never use ordnance, ever ever, in matchmaking, unless we're winning by like 40 kills. It just feels so tacked on and random as it is and I hate seeing 20 beam rifles on the ground in Haven, so I never pick those things up! 

 

I guess I like AA's as a new dynamic, so I would use ordnances, but only if they made them less random, unplannable, and unpredictable, and overpowered. AA's are none of these above things, so I don't mind a little customization to change a little bit of Halo. This is on second thought, to y'all's credit. I still want 343 to remember the competitive community when they make H5, and I want my voice to be heard because I love Halo. Maybe you can just get a SAW, or an air strike, idk… As long as it isn't random ( at ALL). It just feels so tacked on and unwelcome as it is that it was obviously rushed

[Vaulting♥Frog]

Considering I think MLG turned out to be one of the worst things to happen to gaming I hope you can understand that I don't hold any MLG reasoning in any sort of esteem. I respect your opinion, don't think that I don't. I just am of the personal believe that the mindset that MLG and groups like it are so ridged and inflexible that they keep people from growing as gamers.

 

Games shouldn't be stunted in development and innovation because a particular group or multiple groups find a single setting to be the only acceptable way to play the game.

 

Time and again people complain that Halo 4 is like CoD due to the changes that were made. Yet they seem to not understand that with out changes, with out experiments Halo becomes CoD anyways. The gameplay for CoD (while excellent in its development and execution, or so I am told) hasn't changed at all. Beyond the story (and even that is debatable) you have the same experience over and over again through out the series. Getting the idea yet? Make a change in the formula, Halo = CoD, make no change, Halo = CoD.

 

As I stated before, I believe ordnances to be a good thing. They just needed more development. However, again as I said, one can say that about any game as no aspect of it is perfect.

 

Oh and don't get me started on "basketball". It was better when it was played with a giant rock and the loosing team was sacrificed.

[AnimeAddict]

far as what was said earlier 

what is consiered "Halo" is anything that seems like bungie would do it  and that the idea is within the realm of the original ideas for halo and HIT MARKERS DO NOT COUNT  and frankly far as im concerned bungie did kind of screw up with reach by introducing the loadouts but those loadouts werent as bs as the loadouts in H4

[Vinyl Scratch]

The way I see it, 343's Halo 4, is Bungie's Halo:Combat Evolved. It'll take a bit to adjust like what they did in the infinitely awesome Halo 2.

[rrhuntington]

I'm the type of person who just wants the best for the Halo franchise as a whole. I have set back and watched people bicker and argue (not just this site but in general) about what Halo needs to have longevity in it's MP. What I have seen makes me come up with this:

 

50% Competitive

50% Casual

 

What I'm saying is that from what I've seen there must be balance between casual and competitive MP and it must be fine tuned to a T. Not too little or too much for competitive and vice versa. Ordinance drops, from what I've seen, are apart of casual gameplay mechanics. The competitive side of Halo wants a more Halo 2/3 styled MP. Pick up power weapons, no Armor Abilities, pick up Camo, no DMR/boltshot/etc., and No loadouts have all been things the competitive side wants to see. Casual players just seem to seek the fun, semi-competitive nature of the game, just looking for a good time.

 

However, Halo 4 leaned more towards the Casual end of the spectrum. The game made competitive players feel betrayed really, like the game didn't suit them. The competitive players reacted to this very poorly and a little out of control, thinking that Halo was only made to be competitive (not every competitive player thinks this way) and for them. Compromise must be made between the Competitive and the casual, the old and the new. A peaceful society can not be a divided one at the same time.

 

Not everybody is always competitive, nor is everyone always casual, so Halo 5 has the ability to amend this. I hope that they are able to do it.