Do you think Halo can recover?

[Caboose The Ace]

Its not hidden fact since the release of Halo 4 Halo has been on a downwards spiral and has not recovered since. In times long by it was the most talked about most highly esteemed FPS franchise out there but now not so much. So my qustion for you all, do you think Halo can recover from the obvious lack of intrest its reciving at the momment or is the franchise doomed to die a slow death?

[Composite Armour]

Announce Halo 3 on Steam, 100% tailored for PC and full mod support.

 

That would give a nice boost.

[fzdw11]

You have to take my opinion with a grain of salt, as I do not own nor have I played Halo 5. I might some day, but as of right now I still have no desire to own an Xbox One.

 

That disclaimer out of the way, my friends that do play it seem to enjoy it, but they I feel might be jaded by their love of the franchise. I have not looked at any numbers for 5, but it seems since Halo 3, the active players have been dwindling at a slow pace, ever since Bungie left the franchise.

 

Can it recover? I think that it might be possible, but as I write this I am 32, and have been a part of Halo for 16 years now. The old guard have become adults with lives to live, lives that sometimes interfere with video games. With that in mind, they have to find a way to bring on a new generation of players, players who have grown up with a new shooter game every other month it seems. They need something fresh and new to make Halo stand out above the plethora of other games to choose from.

 

That is how they recover, but it might also be how they kill themselves. By abandoning the old guard, those who have been faithful to the game for so many years.

 

Just my two cents.

[Mr Kittens and Gibberish]

@@Composite Armour That wont happen sadly. If they are going to do it anything like that at all, it will be released on the windows store, specifically for Windows 10.

 

Yes. I believe Halo 6 is going to be the greatest Halo game since 3. I have high standards, especially the feedback we have recently received. They realized they up, and have probably scoured forums, their own forums, video's, and blogs about what they could do better.

[Drizzy_Dan]

Halo can recover if 343 goes back to the game's roots. Call of Duty just did it and I have friends who haven't touched an Xbox since MW2 was still popular telling me they might get back into it because of this game. 

 

The community is so divided though it's a mess. A lot of people love the new evolved style of play with Sprint and Spartan Abilities and more like the classic gameplay but not by enough otherwise 343 would've done it already. They've been put in a horrible position by the community and the only way to get out is to cater to one side (which is going to hurt a lot for whichever side loses in the future).

 

I love Halo 5 honestly but I think people would return and numbers would grow if they just took a step backward gameplay-wise and give it a great run and gun campaign.

[I_Make_Big_Boom]

I swear to god, if Halo 3: Anniversary is a thing, and they screw it up again... I can't handle more heartbreak, man :C

 

The fact that they messed with us this bad 2 times in a row is infuriating, and I'm positive that that won't be the last of it. If H3A IS good, then sure, Halo may get a momentary relapse of activity. But there's precedence for MS's mistreatment of the franchise, and once Halo's in a good spot they'll turn down the effort meter, and shove out a less-than-stellar product just to make a quick buck -- probably to sell a console, or whatever kind of hardware they're going to make in the future that's not necessarily a console.

[RedStarRocket91]

Honestly, yes. I know I beat on 343i a lot, but the fact is that between Halo 4 and Halo 5 they've produced both a really strong campaign with incredibly strong emotional ties, and one of the best multiplayers in the series.

 

I have a lot of concerns about Halo 6, and frankly it's going to be the first time where I've owned an Xbox and not bought it day one because in truth I'm not optimistic and given recent messages from 343i it seems like they're not learning lessons, but the potential for a good game is definitely there. If they can replicate the campaign of Halo 4 in terms of its overall characters and narrative, combine that with the gameplay mechanics and balance of Halo 5, and fix (read: excise) the REQ system, it has the potential to be the best one yet. I don't expect that to happen, but it's very much possible, and I'd far rather be wrong than right.

[Fishy]

Well it could, but Halo has taken a CoD turn as many other games have. I don't think it's a matter of "What can they do to be better/return" as much as people just stopped caring. 

 

Don't get me wrong, people still play CoD, but the population has dropped enormously since the older games. Hell, you can leave and join back into the same lobby 5 minutes later, I've done that countless times.

 

Battlefield was always a so-so game with not many players but not a low population. However, Battlefield 1 comes around. Pfft, cool and all but didn't bring attention.

 

And for Halo, it's pretty much the same. Halo 5 was a great start in a good direction, Multiplayer gameplay was great and the mechanics were great. Haters hated, and caused many people to make it a norm. Ex: Spartan Charge, it's not as bad as it sounds but since others complain, you will too... Halo 5 was the best step towards a great Multiplayer. Just stupid decisions by devs that impacted what was already available in place. But that didn't stop people from playing though. Facing smurfs or playing with BR's instead of Magnums didn't cause a huge impact enough for people to quit the game, just the things they used to love to play.

Campaign was a bad step, but lets be honest. A lot of players have yet to even finish the Campaign, the Campaign completion progress says less than 30% at this moment. So Campaign means NOTHING. As bad as most people find it, Multiplayer still holds the higher fanbase than Campaign. Which is where the nerds care anyways.

Other than that, Halo 5 was in a great direction in the majority... But just like Battlefield and CoD, no matter how much they change or what they do. Players are dying off. Whether it be people are moving to PC or people are growing up or are done playing. Halo doesn't have much to do with its player base or impact really, it's something else and I'm not sure what.

[Connor Kenway]

It has, potential to come back but as we recently saw with Halo Wars 2 which people were excited for it died off fairly quickly (I myself still play it) not player count wise as matchmaking doesn't take long at all to find a game but more just seeing it on Youtube etc I don't see it alot.

For me the reason I lost interest in Halo was well, the art style was partially to blame for me I'm not a huge fan of it personally it lost the Halo feel for me that Reach had perfected for me which was that of a military sci-fi shooter (quoting the Act Man here) the gameplay while I don't have an issue with that at all there has also just been other things to play *cough* Rainbow Six Siege *cough*. I do want Halo to recover I really do so I can get back into it and get the enjoyment out of it I once did but as of right now to play Halo 5 is a literal mission for me I have friends to play it with thats not an issue its just I don't find it as fun the gameplay is fine but I won't say its spectacular but I don't have an issue with it either Forge is great however suffers for me from the lack of UNSC air vehicles such as a Falcon or something troop transporty but thats just me personally. So do I think it will recover? yes and no I think it'll get new players but the old ones I'd say is a mix 

[Azaxx]

I'll be completely blunt, no. There is no chance in hell that Halo can recover to the days of Halo 1-3, or even any era with Bungie. 343 Industries have screwed up literally every aspect of the games that they have made that the community has either abandoned them or left prior from foresight.

 

I'll start with posting this video, take a look. It perfectly encapsulates the different philosophy of building Halo between the two parent companies, Bungie and 343i. Bungie take the mindset of "If it's not fun, we're not making it", opposed to 343i's standpoint "Intertwine everything above all else". This is why Halo died, not because of the different sets of talent between the two companies, not because of the way Microsoft interfered with the game's production, nor because of the era of which games are developed (early 2000's opposed to the 2010's).

 

Let's deconstruct why the original trilogy (main titles) were better than the two main titles that 343i have produced.

 

Master Chief was someone that literally everyone could relate to or see inspiration in. He was a blank slate that a person could 'self insert' (I hate that phrase but it applies here), a character that had no in-game personality, only traits such as stoic, courageous and 'gary stu-esk'. He was someone that could not lose under any circumstance because the plot desired him to be victorious after every battle. There is only one instance where this is rejected, and this is in the book Fall of Reach where Chief is born and molded into the soldier he became, however this is now considered not canon by Halo Reach when the ending of the game retconned established lore. By his definition of being a black slate, everyone could relate in a way to him because there was no reason that prevented them from doing so. This is where 343i decided to scrap that philosophy and make the Chief into a character that no person on the planet could ever hope to relate to. 343i decided to make this super soldier tormented, broken and vulnerable to his resolve being broken. In essence, making a character that no one could relate to because the character is nothing like any person alive given the circumstances that Chief went through during the main title games. You can't relate to him after his A.I. (Cortana) 'died', you can't relate to him after he sees the UNSC and ONI turn against him, and you most definitely cannot relate to him once he was reunited with the pseudo-mother whome created him. These are story aspects that 343i created in an attempt to make a character that people could relate to without actually realising that nothing of what he experienced is relateable to what we gamers have experienced in our lives. We haven't been paired with an A.I. or person 24/7 for years, we haven't been turned against by a nation, and we haven't been created as an experiment. This is how 343i failed when making a 'character' out of Chief, they ruined him by destroying the very thing that made him special.

 

 

Second point, what the hell are those campaigns in Halo 4 and 5? Let's start with Halo CE, a simple, well scripted and ultimately well executed narrative (not discussing gameplay for the campaigns) that is remembered because it was both fresh and well designed. Halo 2 introduced a new character gave us gamers a reason to understand why we were fighting them, The Arbiter was a character that gave us both a narrative and gameplay excuse to understand the nature of the force that oppressed us in the first game. This game was ultimately rushed and resulted in a poor ending "Sir, finishing this fight". Halo 3 had a weak narrative but concluded everything well with a fitting ending for a now iconic character. Giving us the tease of a future game was a good idea with the legendary ending of the game. Now, Halo 4. Where do I begin? Didact, I thought he died on the rings? Librarian, wait what, she somehow controlled evolution of the Chief and an A.I. to be in this exact place and time to meet her? Who are the Prometheans? Oh right, you either have to read all of the books or leave the game and open the Halo Channel to understand anything of what's happening in a game. That is poor story telling. When you explain a story, you do it in the damn game, don't make us buy other products and read them before playing the game to have any context prior the opening cutscene begins.

 

Halo 5 Guardians requires its own paragraph because I wish to discuss the gameplay alongside of the narrative. For starters. Four hours? How the hell does years of development result in a campaign playthrough lasting only four hours? For context, I was playing Normal while deliberately going out of my way to explore the levels and find any easter eggs, and it took me four hours to start the opening cutscene to watching the final cutscene play. There is no excuse in any universe that could possibly justify the fact that the story was short, rushed and poorly scripted in every possible imagination. Who are Fireteam Osiris you might ask? Don't worry, you get a line of backstory for each character in the final mission in case you were worrying. Why was the character of Buck ruined? The whole point of him being a highlight character in Halo 3 ODST was because he was an elite ODST with normal guy issues since he was human. As the quote goes "If he were any better, he'd be a Spartan", the whole point of that sentence was the fact that he was so close, but it's not something he'd reach because he was only a normal guy. Making him into a Spartan throws away the character development in his original game and is honestly an insult to the character. Moving to Blue Team, who are they? Well if you're a hardcore Halo fan who read Fall of Reach and First Strike you would understand, otherwise you get literally nothing about them in the game. Why 343i actually wrote them the way they did is beyond me. Next, 3 missions for Blue Team and 12 to Osiris. Why. Halo is about the Master Chief, if I want to play a game about Locke and his team, I'd buy a game specifically about him and his team. Halo 2 did it right, make it a more even split between the level count for the two characters to allow us time to get to know what's happening to both parties. Halo 5 Guardians' shoved Osiris down our throats and tossed Blue Team out of the park so we weren't to worry about them.

 

 

With narrative out of the way, let's move to the gameplay, specifically the multiplayer.

I'll be brief, I hate Halo 2's multiplayer. It was buggy, it was unbalanced and it was not fun to play against exploits which people praise because they're 'skillful'. I'm sorry, but nothing about an exploit is good when was not intended originally by design and poses a disadvantage to those who are unaware of a mechanic that was not intended. That being said, at least Halo 2 had the best fill of maps in any Halo game. Midship, Sanctuary and a Blood Gulch remake, these maps were iconic and well balanced. Most importantly, they were fun to play on and gorgeous to run around in. Name any map from Halo 4 that was like this? I can only think of Exile, it was lush green and fun for vehicles, but what if you didn't like BTB? Tough luck because all of the maps for Arena play sucked. At least Halo 5 changed that, right? Well no because the only top tier map for Halo 5 is a Halo 2 remake, Truth (and its subsequent remaster being Regret). Sure Empire is some fun, so is Coliseum, but they suffer from major issues because 343i cannot understand how to make them well balanced. Halo 4's multiplayer featured ordinances, and thank goodness that 343i removed that concept for Halo 5 Guardians. But decided to have blatantly overpowered Spartan abilities that have near to no counters (i.e. Spartan Charge + magnum combo) and horrible bugs everywhere in the game. Recently (in the past month or so) I decided to download Halo 5 Forge Bundle for the PC to see how things have changed given that I have not played Halo in some time. I thank 343i and Microsoft making it free, but honestly it deserves it. Filled with bugs such as lack of good hit registration, account sign in issues and server joining problems make it an utter night to play. You legitimately have to only play mini-games such as Minotaurs and Sumo Mongoose to enjoy yourself (I admit the fans who made these gametypes did a fantastic job and I'm glad a working File Browser is finally in the game), but if you wanted an Arena experience in customs, it's not for you as the game actively fights you when you want to have fun. I understand that 343i made this product for toying with Forge, but then I ask this, where the hell is any sort of manual in game to understand how the Forge system as a whole works? There is nothing to assist Forgers on the PC platform, let alone new comers who want to make some nifty creations. At least it's not as bad with the bugs as Halo MCC was for over an entire year right?

 

 

I understand that my views here do not match the vast majority of current players of the game on both this forum, other forums, or no forum at all. However, when a company has shown complete lack of care and a drive to improve not only the game, but themselves, it justifies my opinion and beliefs about the company.

343i have consistently shown blatant disregard for Halo as both a franchise and universe, lack of any care for the very basics of the narrative to the balancing and bug fixing of multiplayer have been major eye opening factors for me in realising that 343i do not have any justification to say that they will make Halo great again. I supported them once Halo 4 dropped, saying Halo MCC will be incredible. I supported them once Halo MCC dropped saying that it was a massive undertaking and they bit more than they could chew. I supported their development of Halo 5 Guardians as it seemed exciting, fresh and fun for the franchise.

 

 

They lost my support once the game dropped.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Azaxx

[Buns]

I am going to agree with Azaxx saying Halo will never recover but not only for the reasons he mentioned but additional ones too.

Gaming culture has changed.

That is basically it. What made Halo 1-3 so much fun was because you were forced to play and talk with strangers and that resulted in weird experiences. Wanted to play Halo CE multiplayer? LAN parties or LAN events! Wanted to play Halo 2 multiplayer? Matchmaking with everyone being in the same voice channel! Same with Halo 3. The XBL Party system ruined the magic of meeting new people and having a sense of community. You would meet someone in a Team Slayer and talk about the game or fun custom games you have played or get one of those MESSAGE TO ALL RECENT PLAYERS custom game invites. This is no longer the norm.

Another reason? Xbox is no longer the dominant platform. PS4 has destroyed the Xbox One in this ~"Console Wars"~ and Halo can never recover if they make games that keep losing fans faster than they can bring new ones in. Halo has such a bad PR image at this point it would have to take Halo 3 on Steam with full mod support(something that radical) to fix the brand. 

More reasons! The shooter market is extremely saturated with tons of good(and bad) games to chose from. Not only that but Halo 5 is riddled with such disrespect to the consumer(The REQ system and no free DLC updates isn't a justification) Want to use that prophets bane? Well you only have one left so don't spawn and die right away! 



Halo 6 has such a heavy burden on its shoulder. Halo 4, MCC and 5 have done such damage to the brand that Halo 6 would have to address every single concern AND be able to convince all the people who left the franchise to return AND convince people to buy an X1 so it has a playerbase as big as H3.

So yeah no Halo will never return to its peak days. Unless they seriously release Halo 3 on Steam with full mod support because everyone will go nuts over that. 

[Maestro]

Unless Halo 6 does absolutely everything perfectly, the series will never return to its former glory.

[Twinreaper]

This is exactly why 1st party titles don't have the stamina nor the longevity to survive. Before the thoughts of Nintendo start creeping in, remind yourself that games such as Zelda, Mario and Metroid have no counterpart on the other 2 systems. There has never been any game title so similar in design and character creation to match or saturate those titles.

 

Playstation has some alright titles and so does Xbox, but name one franchise that has sold millions of copies EVERY year and quite frankly evolved the fps genre. Halo did it 2 times. CoD continues to do it. The reason why Halo will never again come out kn top is exactly the reason above. Noone wants to buy an Xbox to play a failed franchise. CoD can be played on 3 systems of your choice, one NOT requiring a ridiculous flawed and over advertisement filled gaming service.

 

If Halo really wanted to regain it's former crown, Microsoft should have branched out right after the obvious marketing of MCC and the game failed. It not only failed to instill confidence in the new developer, but it failed the system as well, making it appear that the Xbox was a poorly executed hardware platform.

 

Halo can't recover going forward. The only way to save Halo story wise, would be to draw on the decades of lore preceding the current story. Going back to simpler ideals, wider reaching story lines and varying environments. In a nut shell, invest in old lore characters and give them the in-game character development that ODST/Reach perfected.

 

As for multiplayer, no title has been fun since Reach. Halo CE is STILL played by hundreds/thousands albeit on PC cause of server support. Halo 2 is still played and regaining momentum thanks to Cartographer. Halo 3 is still played by thousands via Tunngle, Xlink, etc. Their populations and enthusiasm put MCC, 4 and 5 to shame. Multiplayer needs to go back to design basics. Great mkx of small, medium and larger maps that are well thought out and draw around a common theme. Bungie did this with every map, referrencing "Hang em High" as their go to for ALL map design. What does 343 have? Forge. Thats it. No thought, no design plan really....just pan, place, repeat.

 

As far as mechanics it is becoming way to involved. The tactical aspect in comparison to the Bungie titles fails in every way. There is simply far too much controller input and other mechanical flair that weighs down the multiplayer experience. Halo 3 had it exactly right with one time use equipments. Simple base weapons, and no silly bazillion variations that impeed the basic core function of each weapon.

 

Halo is a complete mess. I don't foresee it ever becoming the quality title it once was. Which I guess is fine since the Millenials are now the catered and majority of the gaming world. I am quite happy to fade away still playing the gold standard of the Halo franchise in my undies by myself or with a few older guys/girls.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Twinreaper

[MCPO Mayh3m]

This is exactly why 1st party titles don't have the stamina nor the longevity to survive. Before the thoughts of Nintendo start creeping in, remind yourself that games such as Zelda, Mario and Metroid have no counterpart on the other 2 systems. There has never been any game title so similar in design and character creation to match or saturate those titles.

 

Playstation has some alright titles and so does Xbox, but name one franchise that has sold millions of copies EVERY year and quite frankly evolved the fps genre. Halo did it 2 times. CoD continues to do it. The reason why Halo will never again come out kn top is exactly the reason above. Noone wants to buy an Xbox to play a failed franchise. CoD can be played on 3 systems of your choice, one NOT requiring a ridiculous flawed and over advertisement filled gaming service.

 

If Halo really wanted to regain it's former crown, Microsoft should have branched out right after the obvious marketing of MCC and the game failed. It not only failed to instill confidence in the new developer, but it failed the system as well, making it appear that the Xbox was a poorly executed hardware platform.

 

Halo can't recover going forward. The only way to save Halo story wise, would be to draw on the decades of lore preceding the current story. Going back to simpler ideals, wider reaching story lines and varying environments. In a nut shell, invest in old lore characters and give them the in-game character development that ODST/Reach perfected.

 

As for multiplayer, no title has been fun since Reach. Halo CE is STILL played by hundreds/thousands albeit on PC cause of server support. Halo 2 is still played and regaining momentum thanks to Cartographer. Halo 3 is still played by thousands via Tunngle, Xlink, etc. Their populations and enthusiasm put MCC, 4 and 5 to shame. Multiplayer needs to go back to design basics. Great mkx of small, medium and larger maps that are well thought out and draw around a common theme. Bungie did this with every map, referrencing "Hang em High" as their go to for ALL map design. What does 343 have? Forge. Thats it. No thought, no design plan really....just pan, place, repeat.

 

As far as mechanics it is becoming way to involved. The tactical aspect in comparison to the Bungie titles fails in every way. There is simply far too much controller input and other mechanical flair that weighs down the multiplayer experience. Halo 3 had it exactly right with one time use equipments. Simple base weapons, and no silly bazillion variations that impeed the basic core function of each weapon.

 

Halo is a complete mess. I don't foresee it ever becoming the quality title it once was. Which I guess is fine since the Millenials are now the catered and majority of the gaming world. I am quite happy to fade away still playing the gold standard of the Halo franchise in my undies by myself or with a few older guys/girls.

 

Halo 3. ♥

 

(Literally sitting here in my undies by myself eating waffles wishing I was playing Halo 3)

[Twinreaper]

^^ I'm wearing boxers.  Git Gud and Git on Mah LEVEL BRAH!

[Mr Kittens and Gibberish]

^^^^ Im wearing lounge pants. Sooo much more comfy! U moost git ahn mai livul...

[Twinreaper]

damn you Sierra!!!!! Time to break out my leasure suit. That will surely save Halo... Spartan Leasure Suit Armor FTW

[HARDCORE GAMES]

With so many other games out there any new Halo release will have to be over the top AAA in quality 

 

Even then competition with other AAA action games is fierce 

 

[Caboose The Ace]

With so many other games out there any new Halo release will have to be over the top AAA in quality 

 

Even then competition with other AAA action games is fierce 

 

Fair Point I've actually had a think about this recently and here's my solution. Release the next Halo Game on all consoles and PC with full mod support. Or something like that Halo being an exclusive is killing it at the moment or maybe Halo is just dying a slow death and its time for the franchise to end? I'm not sure but right now the future looks pretty bleak. 

[The Director]

Halo can recover if 343 goes back to the game's roots. Call of Duty just did it and I have friends who haven't touched an Xbox since MW2 was still popular telling me they might get back into it because of this game. 

 

The community is so divided though it's a mess. A lot of people love the new evolved style of play with Sprint and Spartan Abilities and more like the classic gameplay but not by enough otherwise 343 would've done it already. They've been put in a horrible position by the community and the only way to get out is to cater to one side (which is going to hurt a lot for whichever side loses in the future).

 

I love Halo 5 honestly but I think people would return and numbers would grow if they just took a step backward gameplay-wise and give it a great run and gun campaign.

I have to disagree with you on them having to pick a side. What they can do is split the multiplayer into two modes, one that is new and whatnot and the other that goes from the games core and stays true to the old school. It will take an intensive effort, but they'll also be able to determine which one is loved more once and for all. Then they can go from there. They also need to account for longevity and stop trying to replace main characters. That should be a natural flow, not forced like Halo 4.

 

If they don't learn from their mistakes then Halo 6 will be the last.