Say no to ___ in H4

[L4B]

Ok after what has turned into a long chat we not only chatting about bloom so go ahead discuss what we want in H4 and what we dont like

 

 

 

Even though they may already be a thread mentioning all this i was far too lazy to look thorugh all the theads to comment so hey here we all again

 

 

Simple list to get ''Halo'' to the top of the list once again! Those who luv Halo stick by no matter what but hey following simple step on those who play the game and enjoy will only make H4 better! Now that MW3 sucks its time for 343 and Halo to make it to the top and stay there

 

 

So here's what ill suggest:

 

1. NO Bloom

2. No Sprint, armor lock, evade, Jetpack or anything on those terms which give one an advantage once they one shot to either run away like a **** or evade around the corner or like most people do is use Armor lock.... Newbs!!!!

3. Fix the Beat-down system ( Not two beat-Downs) - Hate out BR'ing one to then beat him down which he still survives like a spunge! Was'nt like that in H2 or H3, when in a BR fight you can easily out BR someone but if both are to go for a beat down you should die after, not have to beat him down again for the 2nd time!!!

 

4. Back to the normal Ranking system 0-50

 

5. Lastly make some proper maps! For one im a competetive player so seeing the community go out and make old H3 maps or H2 was a good thing but was a let down for Halo and Bungie not having any maps which stand out in Reach! and dont say Countdown, all you get is kids running around throwing nades all day long!

 

Thanks 343 and hopefully we'll see a great game in the near future with Halo4

[Mr Biggles]

1. Agreed

2. I like the AL, they bring a new idea to the game.

3. Agreed, the beatdowns still don't feel right even after the update.

4. They made a lot of competitive maps, like Asylum and Countdown, they are both competitive, as long as the map is symmetrical, its all good

[Mr. Welldone]

1. Actually, I don't mind bloom.

2. Well, if no Armour Abilities, there should be something new to replace it.

3. Yes, beat down system to be like the old Halos.

4. Hopefully, the new maps will be exciting.

[TheFuriousCamel]

1. I don't mind bloom, but after playing Halo 3 and how fast paced it was in comparison I would like to see it go.

2. I liked Armor Abilities a lot with the exception of armor lock in a non-vehicle/explosive context. I would really like to see them return as well as equipment. I think it would be awesome to have an energy sword and use a grav lift to take out a guy who tried to jetpack away. I think they can return but with a better balance and such. Evade, sprint, and armor lock can go, but I liked the addition of jetpacks, holograms, invisibility, and such. What would be really good for these is a limited use per life, kind of like equipment. You can use hologram 2-3 times, you can be invisible for a total of 20 seconds in a life, you only have a set amount of fuel for jetpacks. I think that would really balance them out and make them more similar to equipment from Halo 3, which should for sure return like the bubble shield, grav lift, power drainer, and trip mine. Balance them out, fine tune them, make them all pick ups rather then starting abilities. I just want to see their presence in the next one, but I wouldnt mind if they didnt show up at all.

3. Approve. I liked how certain guns had more powerful melees like the brute weapons and gave you an incentive to close in and melee. Gave guns a unique identity outside of its ammunition

4. Yeah, I prefer all the DLC maps/cool forge maps over the standard ones. I miss when maps weren't part of the campaign, and they shouldnt be.

 

Halo Reach was for certain an awesome game, and it brought a lot of cool innovation to the series, some of which should stay, and some which shouldnt. Halo 4 should be the ultimate pinnacle of the series so far because of how different 3 and Reach were

[armored penguin]

wow the way u want it makes like call of duty. heres ma thoughts to make it more realistic. first of make armor lock wat it logicly does locks the spartans armor and povents fall damage not complete invisability. for sprint make it last longer but recharge longer. for evade make it only one evade but make it recharge shorter. jet pack, leave the same cause i dont see a problem there.oh and heres a tip, dont like the armor abilities? GO TO HALO 3 THEN!!! and as for the bloom if they dicide to leave zero bloom at least lower the pistol damage or take of the zoom for it.

[Herodanny]

Even though they may already be a thread mentioning all this i was far too lazy to look thorugh all the theads to comment so hey here we all again

 

 

Simple list to get ''Halo'' to the top of the list once again! Those who luv Halo stick by no matter what but hey following simple step on those who play the game and enjoy will only make H4 better! Now that MW3 sucks its time for 343 and Halo to make it to the top and stay there

 

 

So here's what ill suggest:

 

1. NO Bloom

2. No Sprint, armor lock, evade, Jetpack or anything on those terms which give one an advantage once they one shot to either run away like a **** or evade around the corner or like most people do is use Armor lock.... Newbs!!!!

3. Fix the Beat-down system ( Not two beat-Downs) - Hate out BR'ing one to then beat him down which he still survives like a spunge! Was'nt like that in H2 or H3, when in a BR fight you can easily out BR someone but if both are to go for a beat down you should die after, not have to beat him down again for the 2nd time!!!

 

4. Lastly make some proper maps! For one im a competetive player so seeing the community go out and make old H3 maps or H2 was a good thing but was a let down for Halo and Bungie not having any maps which stand out in Reach! and dont say Countdown, all you get is kids running around throwing nades all day long!

 

Thanks 343 and hopefully we'll see a great game in the near future with Halo4

 

I agree to all, I believe you left out something VERY important, and that is, a ranking system. Enough of this BS ranking system where little kids get to the top rank just because they play fire fight all day. We need a H2 rank system that is 1-50 that is NOT based off EXP (nothing is worse than seeing someone with a 50 who only played 15 games)

[Herodanny]

wow the way u want it makes like call of duty. heres ma thoughts to make it more realistic. first of make armor lock wat it logicly does locks the spartans armor and povents fall damage not complete invisability. for sprint make it last longer but recharge longer. for evade make it only one evade but make it recharge shorter. jet pack, leave the same cause i dont see a problem there.oh and heres a tip, dont like the armor abilities? GO TO HALO 3 THEN!!! and as for the bloom if they dicide to leave zero bloom at least lower the pistol damage or take of the zoom for it.

 

I disagree with EVERYTHING you have to say. How about HALO goes back to being HALO like in halo 3 or halo 2 NOT halo reach, cause as far as I'm concerned halo reach is not even halo.

[TheFuriousCamel]

wow the way u want it makes like call of duty. heres ma thoughts to make it more realistic. first of make armor lock wat it logicly does locks the spartans armor and povents fall damage not complete invisability. for sprint make it last longer but recharge longer. for evade make it only one evade but make it recharge shorter. jet pack, leave the same cause i dont see a problem there.oh and heres a tip, dont like the armor abilities? GO TO HALO 3 THEN!!! and as for the bloom if they dicide to leave zero bloom at least lower the pistol damage or take of the zoom for it.

 

I do have to say you don't really understand Halo then if you think WE are trying to make it more like CoD. Halo 3 involved everyone starting off on the same level, weapon pick ups across the map, no extra abilities that noone else had, accuracy was important and you had to pace shots, and it was simply a skill based game.

 

Halo Reach allowed people to "choose" loadouts at the start of map, included armor abilities (see perks in a way), they added bloom so you had to pace your shots, and you could avoid death by simply using a death pause button (armor lock or evade).

 

While I personally enjoyed armor abilities it made the game feel less like Halo and more like a spin off. It needs to go back to what it was which was its own unique identity of Halo 3. I WANT to see some armor abilities return but in a much more balanced and less dominating form.

[Twinreaper]

First off, lets stop with the bloom talk already. nearly 3/4 of the population still does not know what bloom is. Just say instead, you want to just run around with percission wepaons all day insrtead of using a wide variety of firing effect equipment to play with. There is no need to remove anything, just go play a playlist specifically designed to make you 3 shot - 5 shot killers happy. I like my battles drawn out and very tactical thank you.

 

The maps are fine. Let's see you create a better one shall we. There are plenty of HEK tools out there, lets see some of your great planned out works of map art, then you can come back in here and criticise them. Other wise, sit down.

 

All Halo titles were great, it just depends on your perspective of what makes a particular title better than the others. For em personally Halo 2 was and always will be the bees knees for multiplayer, and ODST will always remain my fave go to campaign. But I would not go as far to criticese the developer and tell them anything they produce otherwise is a regurgutated pile of turd. Please be a little more consciderate and state these as YOUR opinions, don't throw words around like you represent the community. I cannot stand that in here.

 

Furthermore, I see a very common pattern within the Halo community. Everytime a newer title comes out, people complain and compare it to the previous and say things like "Bring it back to how it was". Things will be no different when halo 4 comes out. We will see the same rediculous people saying the same tired things about how the game doesn't feel like "Halo", and how they need to change things back to the earlier title. Surfice to say, this community doesn't know what it wants.

[RedStarRocket91]

The maps are fine. Let's see you create a better one shall we. There are plenty of HEK tools out there, lets see some of your great planned out works of map art, then you can come back in here and criticise them. Other wise, sit down.

 

That's a bit unfair, Twinreaper. Just because someone lacks the ability to create a map doesn't necessarily mean they can't judge what is and isn't a good map.

 

Take Pinnacle, for example. I'm not a great map maker by any stretch, but by playing the map I can tell that not only are the spawns badly implemented, but that the team spawning in the tower overlooking the central area (by default the Red team) has an unfair advantage in that they can see almost the entire map, have plenty of cover, and anyone attempting to get into the base has almost no cover while doing so. This is unfair not because it's an incredibly powerful position to hold that allows whoever holds it to dominate the surroundings and dictate the flow of play, but because one team automatically gets it from the start. There's no skill or teamwork involved in taking control of it: either your team has it, or it doesn't.

 

Other maps have their problems, too. The Cage/Uncaged have horrendous problems with sightlines and flow of play, and there aren't really any focal points or key areas that reward map control and teamwork. It's the same story with Haemorrhage, which also really is far too open and lacking in cover.

 

Then you have maps like Reflection, a remake of an older levels with both flaws in engineering (how many people have been killed trying to do nothing more than go up the lift?) and design itself: one team automatically gets the Rocket Launcher, one automatically gets the Energy Sword. Unless someone gets unlucky with the lift, the Sniper Rifle is basically promised to one team, too: so there's not just a problem with power weapons not being contested, but that the teams don't even get equal amounts of those weapons (i.e. one or two per team, with some 'neutral' weapons possibly being scattered around).

 

And then there are levels ripped straight from campaign. The only truly balanced (and thus, genuinely competitive) map of these was Countdown, unpopular due to its poor combination of sight lines and abundance of camping spots. Boardwalk is at least close to being balanced in non-symmetrical-Objective gametypes and for that I can forgive it, but Sword Base suffers from the same problems as Reflection and Countdown: Red Team starts with an immediate height advantage and gets almost guaranteed access to the Concussion Rifle and the Shotgun, again meaning there's an imbalance between power weapon distribution. The yellow lift exit room also has two entrances but only one exit: the fact that there's only one thing you can do is just plain bad design and hurts map pace and flow.

 

Could I design maps better than these myself? No, probably not. But then, I'm not a paid, professional level designer for a series which sells itself on its multiplayer content. But the fact that I personally can't build a better level doesn't mean that problems don't exist within existing maps, and doesn't mean that I am somehow incapable of finding these problems.

[Twinreaper]

I agree that some problems time to time come up in terms of placement of items. but when we talk about forge variants, thats the community, or 343i's attempt to simlulate an older map. Doing that, is like trying to a bullseye on the moon...it's not gonna happen. Also remember, that with reach, we got customized loadouts that make traversing the map easier and that's why certain weapons are placed where they are. It also comes down to playstyle.

 

Most people who game don't naturally work as a "Team", and thus you get 5 to 6 people all scrambling for a power weapon. In MLG where teamwork is a must, you don't see them having much trouble with this sort of thing. but then again, yes I know we are talking about a majority of gamers who don't play for teamwork and only selfish bragging rights. no offense was meant towards anyone else but the OP. His wording of things very much needs to be fine tuned.

[RedStarRocket91]

I agree that some problems time to time come up in terms of placement of items. but when we talk about forge variants, thats the community, or 343i's attempt to simlulate an older map. Doing that, is like trying to a bullseye on the moon...it's not gonna happen.

 

Very true, but that's a limitation of the tools we're given. That's not to say we can't come up with good maps: Synapse is not only well designed in terms of cover, map control points, weapon spawns and balance between teams, but looks really good as well. Same with Affinity and Kingdom. But truly huge or detailed maps aren't forthcoming because of limits on both Forge budgets and item restrictions, and of course the fact that the more 'stuff' the is put into Forge, the more likely it is that framerate issues will start appearing: as regards the latter, if anyone could explain to me exactly why this happens, I'd really appreciate it!

 

Even then, Armor Abilites and differing playstyles don't justify poor power weapon placement or map design. A team should not have most of the power weapons or control an incredibly strong map position (e.g. the tower on Pinnacle or the top of the elevator on Reflection) just because they were lucky enough to start on one team rather than the other: both teams should have an equal chance to access particularly important weapons and key areas from the start of the game. If people choose to run around by themselves rather than working as a team or charge around looking to get into a fight as fast as possible instead of controlling power weapons, that is why they should lose, not because the map itself is inherently imbalanced.

 

no offense was meant towards anyone else but the OP. His wording of things very much needs to be fine tuned.

 

Now there's something we definitely agree on!

[FIREN4]

Well, Armor Abilities are fine. I actually also like armor lock. It's a defense tactic, and a pain for your enemies.

Like Twinreaper, 3/4 of people,as an example, don't know what bloom is.

Very true, but that's a limitation of the tools we're given. That's not to say we can't come up with good maps: Synapse is not only well designed in terms of cover, map control points, weapon spawns and balance between teams, but looks really good as well. Same with Affinity and Kingdom. But truly huge or detailed maps aren't forthcoming because of limits on both Forge budgets and item restrictions, and of course the fact that the more 'stuff' the is put into Forge, the more likely it is that framerate issues will start appearing: as regards the latter, if anyone could explain to me exactly why this happens, I'd really appreciate it!

 

Even then, Armor Abilites and differing playstyles don't justify poor power weapon placement or map design. A team should not have most of the power weapons or control an incredibly strong map position (e.g. the tower on Pinnacle or the top of the elevator on Reflection) just because they were lucky enough to start on one team rather than the other: both teams should have an equal chance to access particularly important weapons and key areas from the start of the game. If people choose to run around by themselves rather than working as a team or charge around looking to get into a fight as fast as possible instead of controlling power weapons, that is why they should lose, not because the map itself is inherently imbalanced.

 

Also good point here. I dislike how there's a Gausshog in Anniversary BTB. And the only chance of survival is if the Gauss is immediately targeted and destroyed. Or if you have a really good Banshee pilot. Still though, i think it's nice to see the Gauss' return.

[MasterxChiefx13]

Meh. Halo is Halo, I'll love it no matter what changes are made! Also, I've played enough that I hardly notice the "bloom." I just simply adapted from Halo 3 and kept playing. Yes it may make it more difficult to kill an opponent, for some people, but to me it doesn't matter that much.

[Fail Master]

1) not agreed, although should be a playlist called ''zero bloom'' for all the newbs who want it

2) AA are usefull in most situations, but need to be limmited a bit more

3) the beat downs are fine as it is, i a spartan can flip a scorpian with no real difficulty then in theory he could 1 hit beat down another spartan so 2 hits is giving a bit more of a chance.

4) the maps will be alot better if 343 take any notice of these forums.

[InsaneBear]

Even though they may already be a thread mentioning all this i was far too lazy to look thorugh all the theads to comment so hey here we all again

 

 

Simple list to get ''Halo'' to the top of the list once again! Those who luv Halo stick by no matter what but hey following simple step on those who play the game and enjoy will only make H4 better! Now that MW3 sucks its time for 343 and Halo to make it to the top and stay there

 

 

So here's what ill suggest:

 

1. NO Bloom

2. No Sprint, armor lock, evade, Jetpack or anything on those terms which give one an advantage once they one shot to either run away like a **** or evade around the corner or like most people do is use Armor lock.... Newbs!!!!

3. Fix the Beat-down system ( Not two beat-Downs) - Hate out BR'ing one to then beat him down which he still survives like a spunge! Was'nt like that in H2 or H3, when in a BR fight you can easily out BR someone but if both are to go for a beat down you should die after, not have to beat him down again for the 2nd time!!!

 

4. Lastly make some proper maps! For one im a competetive player so seeing the community go out and make old H3 maps or H2 was a good thing but was a let down for Halo and Bungie not having any maps which stand out in Reach! and dont say Countdown, all you get is kids running around throwing nades all day long!

 

Thanks 343 and hopefully we'll see a great game in the near future with Halo4

Thank you. Sprint is a joke in halo and so is bloom. The halo reach gameplay was such a disaster, i don't know how people can even play it.

[InsaneBear]

Meh. Halo is Halo, I'll love it no matter what changes are made! Also, I've played enough that I hardly notice the "bloom." I just simply adapted from Halo 3 and kept playing. Yes it may make it more difficult to kill an opponent, for some people, but to me it doesn't matter that much.

Thats because your a noob who gets **** on constantly and every game for you is the same haha

[RedStarRocket91]

Thats because your a noob who gets **** on constantly and every game for you is the same haha

 

You kiss your mother with that mouth? Seriously dude, someone says they've enjoyed every game in the series and that they've made the effort to learn how to play with the new game mechanics, and you call that person a n00b? What's wrong with you?

[InsaneBear]

You kiss your mother with that mouth? Seriously dude, someone says they've enjoyed every game in the series and that they've made the effort to learn how to play with the new game mechanics, and you call that person a n00b? What's wrong with you?

I just hate reach with a passion and hate anyone who supports it.

[CandiBunni]

I just hate reach with a passion and hate anyone who supports it.

 

Hating someone just for liking a game you don't makes you pretty foolish. =/ You should learn to respect that other people have different tastes than you.

[Mr Biggles]

I just hate reach with a passion and hate anyone who supports it.

 

go Back to CoD where all of the other trolls are.

[Twinreaper]

Bear, if you can explain to me why Reach is bad, besides the tired old uninformed non-gaming mechanic view of it...I will agree then with your position. Bashing someone for liking games that you do not is not only severly immature, but shows you have a limited mind when it comes to gaming entertainment.

 

I for one absolutely love Reach. I love it because it has proven to be a challenge time and time again inc ampaign and the ammount of replay built into the basic core mechanics hands down beats every other Halo title...my opinion of coarse.

 

On the engine side of things, the Blam! engine powering Reach is a great hybrid variant and really excells at controlling and handling variable content of any type across all the modes. It is really an engine ahead of it's time.

 

I'm gonna go ahead anyway and continue this final post in this thread with a lengthy long-winded response at which I am known for. Feel free to correct, contradict or add to anything I miss...

 

 

Ok so the thread is about Bloom in particular. For those who do not understand bloom, bloom is the common term used to describe the firing spread of a weapon. In Halo Reach, for the first time, we got an expanding and retracting reticule to show players on screen, the size and resting time of a weapons bloom. The common misconception, is that the reticule itself controls bloom, and that bloom is an entirely new feature they introduced in Reach. Part of that is correct. The correct part is that the firing spread of a weapon was handed down to perc. weapons across the board for the first time. Now bloom itself in a minimalistic sense has always been present even on marksmanship weapons.

 

Halo had bloom on the pistol, but not the sniper rifle. In fact, the Magnum from H1 is to date, the only scoped weapon to ever have it's firing spread, go beyond the confines of the reticule.

 

Halo 2 had bloom on the battle rifle. You can argue this all you want, but tag data extracted from the battle rifle weapon, specifically shows an error cone, but yes the error value is very very small. But this is also why if you slow down the firing, you will see a variation of bullets at different trajectories each firing burst.

 

Halo 3 had a slight bloom in the form of the scope not resetting directly where you had it aimed with the sniper rifle. This was done to force snipers from spamming perfect shots on people.

 

Halo reach simply only added the HUD reticule feature to give every player an even chance of guaging where the shots would land at what particular pace they were firing at. All the TU update did was make every marksman weapon fire similar the beloved BR everyone had missed from previous 2 titles. Even after giving the TU, people still ahve complaints about the 7 float values they changed with MegaloScript to achieve this. COmplaints ranged from overpowered, to too fast firing rates. the thing is, to change certain values, you have to inherintly change others. They can closely achieve BR and h1 magnum firing effects, but it will always feel a little weird or different than the original ones. When things like this happen, it all comes down to how well you adapt to abnormal changes in a game that ahs a completely different gameplay feel. Could you imagine what would of happened if they suddenly thru AA's into a Halo 3 DLC? It would have been hated upon in an instant because it altered gameplay too dramatically for what was already present in the core game.

 

Last but not least is the map problems. maps are very hard to assemble. It may seem like an easy thing to place certain things at a certain place, but it is more invloved than that. Every map that come down at core basics, is layed out to support every default wepaon. Sometimes the designers have no choice but to settle on certain wepaon placements for things, wether they work or not. The same goes for spawn points.

 

Spawn points are a much larger problem. Spawns have a myriad of different settings and groups. Along with basic spawns for individual players, we also have the following...

 

a. Group or "Spawn Zones"

b. Respawn points

c. Respawn Zones

d. Flag Away Zones

e. Flag at home Zones

f. Proximity Zones

 

It is hard on small maps to fit all these in where it becomes a consistent flow of goodness. There are bound to be poorly placed ones, but it comes down to being able to encoprorate every needed item accordingly. So as you see some things are bound to not work sometimes. Sometimes, you have to take a few steps back and see things from a game mechanic and tool usage perspective.

[Tesseract]

I just hate reach with a passion and hate anyone who supports it.

Because video games determines a person right? You take games way too seriously.

[Donut]

Halo 1 Please. O_o Halo 2??? o_O HALO 3?????

Please, Reach was good, brought some new features, but stick to the Halo we all know and LOVE.

I heard a rumor that it's going to be a mix with all the Halo's... hmm, sounds good. Halo 2/3 Ranking system.

Halo 3 Elites, Cr to buy stuff, just not to rank up.

Equipment can stay, it helped against enemies and vehicles, like Trip Mines and Bubble Shields were classic.

No Armor Abilites, Sprint and Evade were nice features, but a little too much with Armor Lock.

If there are no AA's, maybe the same speed as Halo 3's gameplay?

Halo 4 also needs an improvement on Forge, Reach, Reach did a nice job, fan's wanted a bit too much.

Vehicles like Warthog and / or Hornet we classic vehicles that were awesome on map's like Sandtrap and Valahalla.

Speaking of map's, the map's should be like Halo 3's, a classic feel, not to big, not too small, some small map's, some large map's. Forge map's seperate.

The map's in Forge, you should be able to change weather effects, SNOW or RAIN, or DRY or RAINY, but, it might be Forerunner, so please don't make everything all Forerunner, like Forge World, practically everything was a Forerunner Feeling.

I really liked the Phased, Fixed or normal tecniques, it was nice, but some objects were on Fixed, even when they were on Phased.

Gameplay should be smooth, not laggy, like Reach, when someone left, the whole game stopped for like 2 minutes - 5, this is "Optional", Dedicated Servers.

A 4 player Theater, and a better Firefight with actual UNSC marines/ ODST's helping you out against maybe Forerunners/Covenant?

NEW GAMEMODES, and again, classic map's, a big Forge map seperate, please, new gametypes and settings where we can edit the whole game.

 

Well, ha ha, if this is not too much to ask.

Remember, this is ALL, COMPLETELY, my opinion, this is alot, but Halo needs to get back to the top, where it belongs!

And I LOVE HALO with all my heart, (sorry CoD fan's, but GTFO!), we must kick COD down to the bottom!

HALO should be on top, Skyrim is on top, but it take's time for those game's to be made, and you're probably wondering, "Why is Skyrim in this post?"

It is because Skyrim is one of the top games right now, and again, Halo needs it's rightful place, the TOP of the leaderboard.

We all know and remember those moments when you cheered, when you remember those classic moments in Matchmaking and Customs and Campaign, fighting in Master Chief's glorious armor, attacking the raging Flood, killing your friends, laughing at those wonderful Skyjacks and Hijacks through the sky, using you boss magnum, your Assault Rifle, blasting enemies. You all remember it, even if you were 10, or 7 or 15, or 12 or 5 when you 1st played it, you all know that one moment when you were like "OMG!" "HALO IS AWESOME!", yes, you do. Don't deny, Halo, is not finished, and I congradulate 343industries for not letting Halo down, and Bungie for these 10 MAGICAL, AWESOME, AMAZING YEARS! :yahoo:

 

(THIS IS ALL MY OPINION) Thank you for reading.

 

-Donut

[Mr Biggles]

HALO should be on top, Skyrim is on top, but it take's time for those game's to be made, and you're probably wondering, "Why is Skyrim in this post?"

It is because Skyrim is one of the top games right now

-Donut

 

The reason skyrim is at the top is because it was one of the best games ever made in the past decade, hence, why it won GOTY, skyrim is better because it stands out from the pack, its gonna be hard for halo to top that, i don't think it will get to first, but it can come close.