Bring back "Pinnacle" and "Uncaged" in Team Swat!!!!

[Baby Boo]

Again, ignorant and arrogant statements. Nobody who buys this game should be obligated to be a part of any little elitest club. I won't reply further to this drivel.

 

Ignorant and arrogant, maybe so. True and reasonable as well.

[Frenzy Master51]

Occasional sword base? I always get sword base.... very rarely countdown though... but pinnacle was the best map for swat... its bad that they removed pinnacle and sword base from infection

[Geran85]

Ignorant and arrogant, maybe so. True and reasonable as well.

 

That word doesn't mean what you think it means.

[mikeyr]

Quite honestly, that's their problem. Don't have a PC? Or a laptop/netbook? Use your phone. Don't have a phone? Use an iPod touch. Don't have one of those? Find alternate means of accessing the internet. None of the above work? To bad. Not our problem. And don't gimme the "Oh, they might not know about the site!" Honestly, that ain't no excuse. They know which company runs the system, so why can't they put 2 and 2 together and realize they MOST LIKELY have a site? A site that, oh I don't know... probably makes the decisions regarding the game? Yeah. And if they don't know the company that runs the game, well, again, that's their problem. If people want their opinion voiced, they can type in the small URL in the search box, and do it themselves.

 

Since when and how is the average casual player of Swat supposed to know that these maps were even being considered for removal? XBOX Live reps didn't even know these maps were removed! Why not some sort of XBOX Live poll beforehand? I had no idea that this was about to happen, and if I did, I would have voiced my opinion a long time ago at the appropriate time. Without proper replacement maps provided this decision makes absolutely no sense at all, it literally cripples the Swat game that was already suffering from too few map choices to start with.

 

Let's face it, the following maps in no particular order are probably played probably 95% of the time:

 

1. Sword Base

2. Asylum

3. Countdown

4. Reflection

5. Pinnacle (removed)

6. Uncaged (removed)

 

So BulletStorm207 you are ok with the company removing 1/3 (2 of out 6) of the options for map selection for Swat? How does having less choices make the game better? If you don't like a particular map that's selected, why wouldn't you just drop out of the game before it even started?

 

The popularity of Pinnacle and Uncaged speak for themselves among the normal players of Swat. We either need these maps returned to the normal selection process or give us adequate replacements. I personally loved both of those maps, so PLEASE return them to the selection rotation!

[Azaxx]

 

Dude, I don't care about your stats. If you "played" a lot of swat that is past tense...we're talking about the present.

 

Ok i play alot of SWAT, happy

[ZB-85]

I really did like those maps. But it really doesn't bother me that they are gone, I will just play the other maps.

[Anarchy]

I like how they took out Uncaged but I think pinacal should've stayed. Well you know, out with the old in with the new

[Kittennation]

I've played a bit of SWAT and so far, like the OP stated, I only really have seen Reflection and Countdown. Occasionally I'll get Zealot, which I believe is a fun, fast paced map. I think the small selection of maps does get a tad repetitive and would enjoy seeing some new added maps. Maybe some people can make some nice balanced forge maps specifically for SWAT?

[mijknahs]

I admit I enjoyed playing Pinnacle and Uncaged. They were fun! I didn't care what color I was (red or blue). I'm bummed they are not choices anymore. Yes, I get mostly Reflection and Asylum now. Occasionally others.

 

Why aren't there more maps for SWAT? How come High Noon and those other rare ones don't show up more?

[Mr Biggles]

That is an arrogant and ignorant assumption. It discounts the opinions of paying customers who are either unaware of this website or uninterested in making daily forum activity a part of their gameplay. I personally know xbox owners who play online, but do not even own a pc. However, these people are still paying customers and still deserve to have a voice. What they don't deserve is to have their gaming experience crippled by a video game company's pandering to a vocal minority in a backwater corner of the internet. The people who work at 343 should be smarter than that, and if they aren't then they should hand the franchise over to a company that knows what they're doing.

 

The people at 343 are doing what they can off the people who raise their voice, if some people are unable to raise their voice for whatever reason, what are 343 meant to do? they can't ask every single person's opinion who has ever played halo on a certain subject or they'd be there forever, stop being so harsh, and last time i checked, there was a huge outcry to have pinnacle and uncaged removed too.

 

Just chill out a bit man, everyone has an opinion, however, only certain people can say it.

[The Director]

I've made it to Mythic off of Team SWAT, and Uncaged and Pinacle have always been my least favorite maps for SWAT. The reason being that both games are not only camp heavy, but the camping spots overlook spawn areas. SWAT is a one shot one kill variant, so it makes no sense to have spots that you don't really have any particular reason to move from overlooking spawn areas. Let me break this down for you.

 

Uncaged: There are three main camping spots in this map. One at sniper spawn (AKA mancannon), one at healthpack elbow (the one overlooking the cage), and the cage. Sniper spawn overlooks tower spawn, healthpack elbow overlooks sniper spawn, tower spawn, mancannon landing spawn, and rocket spawn, and the cage overlooks tower spawn, the elbow, and mancannon spawn. The tower I am not counting as a camping spot because it's very easy to remove someone in that area from all three of the other areas and it only fits one person out of four. Blue team spawns in the immediate vicinity of two of these camping spots, and has no problem picking off red team as it tries to rush for the third. That means that blue team has the starting advantage right off the get-go. That means... yep you guessed it, unbalanced gameplay.

 

Pinnacle: There are three main camping grounds on this map as well, which also overlook spawn points. There is sniper tower, two story tower, and banshee spawn. Sniper tower overlooks every spawn point on the map, two story tower overlooks banshee, sniper, and teleport receiver spawn points, and banshee spawn overlooks two story tower, teleport sender, and sniper tower spawns. On this map, red team spawns INSIDE a campground, and can pick off blue team as it tries to rush for the other camp grounds. Red team can literally just sit down and it has at least 3 spawn zones covered at the start of the game. Guess what? MORE unbalanced gameplay.

 

If you get matched against people who have decent aim and are playing as a team, you will be lucky not to get steaked. VERY lucky. As in you have a guy who is probably using an aimbot on your team, and even he is going to get spawn-killed a few times. Don't get me wrong, my first perfection was on Pinnacle for the very same reasons I've listed for you. However it was in a match that I actually felt bad for my opponent because we were not letting them even take two steps out of their spawn.

 

We don't need Uncaged and Pinnacle back, what we DO need is some new maps to play on.

[mikeyr]

I like how they took out Uncaged but I think pinacal should've stayed. Well you know, out with the old in with the new

 

Anarchy, thank you for your reply. I think that's part of my problem with removal of these two maps, there were no "in with the new" as you say. These maps were removed and replaced with........well um nothing! And it seems the search algorithms were never modified to take into account that there are less maps to now choose from, so for myself, I always end up getting either Reflection/Asylum or Asylum/Reflection as choices and this gets old really quick. The other night I probably played 15+ games, and I bet I played only 2-3 non Asylum/Reflection games. After a while this is not fun! :thumbdown:

[Geran85]

I've made it to Mythic off of Team SWAT, and Uncaged and Pinacle have always been my least favorite maps for SWAT. The reason being that both games are not only camp heavy, but the camping spots overlook spawn areas. SWAT is a one shot one kill variant, so it makes no sense to have spots that you don't really have any particular reason to move from overlooking spawn areas. Let me break this down for you.

 

Uncaged: There are three main camping spots in this map. One at sniper spawn (AKA mancannon), one at healthpack elbow (the one overlooking the cage), and the cage. Sniper spawn overlooks tower spawn, healthpack elbow overlooks sniper spawn, tower spawn, mancannon landing spawn, and rocket spawn, and the cage overlooks tower spawn, the elbow, and mancannon spawn. The tower I am not counting as a camping spot because it's very easy to remove someone in that area from all three of the other areas and it only fits one person out of four. Blue team spawns in the immediate vicinity of two of these camping spots, and has no problem picking off red team as it tries to rush for the third. That means that blue team has the starting advantage right off the get-go. That means... yep you guessed it, unbalanced gameplay.

 

I'm rank above you (Noble), predominantly off of SWAT, and I simply don't have the problems you're claiming exist. There is not a camping point you've mentioned that I can't remove people from and I'm not particularly special in terms of gaming ability. I generally score first strike and one other kill regardless of which side I spawn on-- and that is not always from playing the immediate long-range shootout that is available at the beginning of Uncaged. The so-called starting advantages that you're talking about simply don't exist.

 

That aside, it doesn't really matter if it does. As stated, it is never difficult to get SWAT players to vote for Uncaged, and that is the only fan feedback that should be taken into account when deciding whether or not the map should be kept in the playlist. A few squeaky wheels on the internet should not be afforded the power to drastically alter the gameplay for the majority of gamers who have been quite happily playing on those maps day-in-and-day-out since the game's release.

 

Pinnacle: There are three main camping grounds on this map as well, which also overlook spawn points. There is sniper tower, two story tower, and banshee spawn. Sniper tower overlooks every spawn point on the map, two story tower overlooks banshee, sniper, and teleport receiver spawn points, and banshee spawn overlooks two story tower, teleport sender, and sniper tower spawns. On this map, red team spawns INSIDE a campground, and can pick off blue team as it tries to rush for the other camp grounds. Red team can literally just sit down and it has at least 3 spawn zones covered at the start of the game. Guess what? MORE unbalanced gameplay.

 

I actually prefer to spawn blue on this map, and again, generally grab First Strike and another couple of kills before being taken down. Again, I am not special in terms of gamer skill. The only time this map gets particularly brutal is when you have a team that doesn't work well together and allows the other team to grab both towers. In that case, it isn't unbalanced gameplay (which does not exist on this map) that is causing it to be brutal, it is the fact that one team is outplaying the other.

 

Again, this entire argument is rendered irrelevant because players frequently prefer this map over the maps remaining in the playlist. It is a popular map with the majority of SWAT players and, again, should not be condemned and removed simply because a vocal minority has made it their mission to complain about the map at every opportunity.

 

...we DO need is some new maps to play on.

 

I do agree with this. Prior to the removal of two of SWAT's most popular maps it already had a tendency to feel barren and repetitive in comparison to some of the others.

[mikeyr]

The people at 343 are doing what they can off the people who raise their voice, if some people are unable to raise their voice for whatever reason, what are 343 meant to do? they can't ask every single person's opinion who has ever played halo on a certain subject or they'd be there forever, stop being so harsh, and last time i checked, there was a huge outcry to have pinnacle and uncaged removed too.

 

Just chill out a bit man, everyone has an opinion, however, only certain people can say it.

 

Hi Mr. Biggles thank you for your comment. My response to this is that I guess 343 Industries pre-warned the average Swat player that these maps were under consideration for removal correct? Probably by some sort of notification page being inserted into the Swat selection process? Or maybe an online poll of some sort? Or some other means they could have thought up. At least they warned the general Swat community so that the average Swat player could voice their opinion? I mean that just makes common sense.

 

Obviously none of the above happened. As Geran85 stated below:

 

Again, this entire argument is rendered irrelevant because players frequently prefer this map over the maps remaining in the playlist. It is a popular map with the majority of SWAT players and, again, should not be condemned and removed simply because a vocal minority has made it their mission to complain about the map at every opportunity.

 

The only thing that should matter is voting during the map selection process. If these maps were not being chosen because no one liked them, sure then I'm all for there removal. But that is not the case they were being chosen at every opportunity. Let the larger Halo Swat community decide which maps should stay or go (again based on map selection voting), not some small vocal minority group that just happens to know about this website.

 

Ok I will give you another for instance. I personally can not stand Reflection I shudder every time it's chosen. I guess since I hate this map, I should start complaining on this forum to get it removed. I would suspect a few other people probably don't like it either, so they will chime in as well. So 343 industries, based on a small group of people speaking up and without even informing anyone else that this is even being contemplated, should remove this map and of course not replace it with anything else. Then we will have even less choices of maps to play Swat. And this somehow will bring more players to play Swat. Makes total sense right? Of course not it makes no sense!

 

There are really no good arguments to removing these maps. I'm still waiting on a 343 Industries rep to explain on this thread why removing two very popular maps makes sense and will bring more players to Team Swat. Since 343 Industries listens/monitors this forum, I would hope they can also respond as well.

[Fed63]

Hello everyone,

 

I registered on this forum to say that the update is not consistent.

 

Why 343industries removed cards that many people liked?

Pinnacle is (was?) The best map for SWAT.

Uncaged was fun (especially this allowed to switch maps).

 

 

Especially, why not put other new maps instead?

 

I had to do 30 games today and it is always the same maps that come ... (sword base, reflection, countdown)

It's boring now.

 

Therefore we will be back to do some "Team Slayer" to switch maps ...

[Geran85]

The people at 343 are doing what they can off the people who raise their voice, if some people are unable to raise their voice for whatever reason, what are 343 meant to do? they can't ask every single person's opinion who has ever played halo on a certain subject or they'd be there forever, stop being so harsh, and last time i checked, there was a huge outcry to have pinnacle and uncaged removed too.

 

Just chill out a bit man, everyone has an opinion, however, only certain people can say it.

 

I'm sorry, I entirely missed this post earlier.

 

As a matter of fat, you are entirely wrong. 343 is the game developer and has control of the game's serves. They are fully capable of asking every single player's opinion. Not only could they post a notice, much like Mikeyr has suggested, they can quite easily look at the voting tendencies of every player who participates online. They've done this before, publicly, with the TU and vanilla options in Team Slayer. Implying that 343 is doing what they can to garner actual player feedback is ludicrous. We know that they can accurately evaluate the maps' popularity, and anyone that plays SWAT, whether they love them or hate them, knows that these maps are frequently voted into play over the maps that were left in the playlist. There is no defendable reason for them to promote the demands of a vocal few on the internet over the habits of gamers who play day-in-and-day-out.

 

As for your personal comments directed toward me, all I can tell you is that you do not know me and you do not know what frame of mind I am in when I post here.

[TheLazyGirl]

 

 

I'm rank above you (Noble), predominantly off of SWAT, and I simply don't have the problems you're claiming exist. There is not a camping point you've mentioned that I can't remove people from and I'm not particularly special in terms of gaming ability. I generally score first strike and one other kill regardless of which side I spawn on-- and that is not always from playing the immediate long-range shootout that is available at the beginning of Uncaged. The so-called starting advantages that you're talking about simply don't exist.

 

That aside, it doesn't really matter if it does. As stated, it is never difficult to get SWAT players to vote for Uncaged, and that is the only fan feedback that should be taken into account when deciding whether or not the map should be kept in the playlist. A few squeaky wheels on the internet should not be afforded the power to drastically alter the gameplay for the majority of gamers who have been quite happily playing on those maps day-in-and-day-out since the game's release.

 

 

 

I actually prefer to spawn blue on this map, and again, generally grab First Strike and another couple of kills before being taken down. Again, I am not special in terms of gamer skill. The only time this map gets particularly brutal is when you have a team that doesn't work well together and allows the other team to grab both towers. In that case, it isn't unbalanced gameplay (which does not exist on this map) that is causing it to be brutal, it is the fact that one team is outplaying the other.

 

Again, this entire argument is rendered irrelevant because players frequently prefer this map over the maps remaining in the playlist. It is a popular map with the majority of SWAT players and, again, should not be condemned and removed simply because a vocal minority has made it their mission to complain about the map at every opportunity.

 

 

 

I do agree with this. Prior to the removal of two of SWAT's most popular maps it already had a tendency to feel barren and repetitive in comparison to some of the others.

 

I agree with everything you've just said. I'm also a mythic off of SWAT, very close to noble rank at that and don't see any of these problems. I also prefer blue spawn over red.

[mikeyr]

No; you may ask why.

Because I just played Pinnacle on SWAT a few hours ago

Derp.

 

So how exactly did you play Pinnacle on Swat just a few hours ago when it was removed in the April Update?

[mikeyr]

No; you may ask why.

Because I just played Pinnacle on SWAT a few hours ago

Derp.

 

 

So last night I played 10 games of Swat: 8 Asylum or Reflections, 1 game of Arena Zealot, 1 game of Countdown. Pinnacle was no where to be seen. I can only take so much Reflection and Asylum before I quit playing Swat. So 343 Industries I'm pleading with you here: please give us either Pinnacle and Uncaged back or some new cool maps.

 

I see a lot of views on this thread, so people don't be afraid to comment....if you want these maps back, please make your voice heard!

[fzdw11]

So last night I played 10 games of Swat: 8 Asylum or Reflections, 1 game of Arena Zealot, 1 game of Countdown. Pinnacle was no where to be seen. I can only take so much Reflection and Asylum before I quit playing Swat. So 343 Industries I'm pleading with you here: please give us either Pinnacle and Uncaged back or some new cool maps.

 

I see a lot of views on this thread, so people don't be afraid to comment....if you want these maps back, please make your voice heard!

 

While I can appreciate wanting the maps back, I don't have an opinion either way with them. People always complain about blue spawn on pinnacle getting screwed, but really it's just a matter of knowing how to play the map. Don't run up the side ramps off blue spawn right at the beginning, it's the quickest way to get shot.

 

I liked both pinnacle and uncaged, but them not being there is fine by me. What's not fine, however, is the fact that they were not replaced. Taking away two options, but not replacing them is a bit stupid, in my opinion. Games of SWAT have really boiled down to Asylum, with a sprinkling of other maps, and it gets extremely frustrating playing Asylum game after game after game.

[Ccup-mann]

Pinnacle was a spawn kill fest, im glad that's gone. Uncaged had no problem from what i could see and was fun map. Does anyone ever find the kill feed in swat annoying, because it goes across the dmr reticle?

[fzdw11]

Pinnacle was a spawn kill fest, im glad that's gone. Uncaged had no problem from what i could see and was fun map. Does anyone ever find the kill feed in swat annoying, because it goes across the dmr reticle?

 

I play on a fairly large TV, the only time the kill feed ever interferes is when I'm playing split-screen, and even then, it needs to be four players playing before it starts to interfere.

[Ccup-mann]

 

 

I play on a fairly large TV, the only time the kill feed ever interferes is when I'm playing split-screen, and even then, it needs to be four players playing before it starts to interfere.

I play on a 32" tv and it interferes, I wish there was an option to take the feed off

[mikeyr]

I play on a fairly large TV, the only time the kill feed ever interferes is when I'm playing split-screen, and even then, it needs to be four players playing before it starts to interfere.

 

I agree with fzdw11 I play on a fairly large TV (50 inch) mostly by myself and it doesn't bother me. Now I have played at a friend's house on a 60 inch TV with 4 people split-screen and the feed definitely does interfere with game play. I agree there should be an option to remove the feed.

[fzdw11]

I agree with fzdw11 I play on a fairly large TV (50 inch) mostly by myself and it doesn't bother me. Now I have played at a friend's house on a 60 inch TV with 4 people split-screen and the feed definitely does interfere with game play. I agree there should be an option to remove the feed.

 

The thing that I hate most is commodations popping up in the middle of combat. If I'm fighting two guys below me, and I kill one and a commodation pops up that blocks the other from view? Yeah, not so cool. But this is all off topic.

 

The thing is, with Pinnacle and Uncaged gone, they really should have replaced them with two new maps. But 343 is busy focusing on Halo 4 at the moment, and while I'm sure making minor tweaks to playlists should be fairly simple, they do need to take time out to test maps before adding them to a certain playlist. That's probably why we didn't see any replacements.